ATF in primary...WOW!
#41
06-30-2016, 04:54 PM
Thanks, I appreciate the link.
If I give the ATF a try again I'll add the Lubeguard, perhaps that's what it takes to get ATF to work. I sure didn't care for how the bike shifted when the ATF was in the primary.
I suspect I'm a candidate for the Baker compensator and manual attitude tensioner, they're my next upgrade. When your fluid is right there's not a sound but use the wrong stuff and the clunk from the compensator is quite audible. The drama with the newer HD's and the compensators is something that shouldn't be happening, way too many failures are being posted by forum members.
Edit: My brain can't even keep it all straight any longer
I posted the results HERE I've since tried LiquiMoly 10W-60 racing 4T but so far nothing touches the Mobil 1 racing 4T 10W-40 synthetic for smooth upshifts, accurate rev-matched downshifts and not any clanking or banging around with the poorly designed compensator...
I suspect I'm a candidate for the Baker compensator and manual attitude tensioner, they're my next upgrade. When your fluid is right there's not a sound but use the wrong stuff and the clunk from the compensator is quite audible. The drama with the newer HD's and the compensators is something that shouldn't be happening, way too many failures are being posted by forum members.
Edit: My brain can't even keep it all straight any longer
I posted the results HERE I've since tried LiquiMoly 10W-60 racing 4T but so far nothing touches the Mobil 1 racing 4T 10W-40 synthetic for smooth upshifts, accurate rev-matched downshifts and not any clanking or banging around with the poorly designed compensator...
#42
07-03-2016, 10:32 PM
Elite HDF Member
I know it's an old thread but since it came back into circulation I thought I would rebuttal these concerns. The following quotes identify concerns regarding parts other than the clutches, in reality there should be no issues with the chain, sprockets or roller bearings. Take a look at most anything manufactured from the mid/late 80's on, they use ATF in the manual transmissions (gears and roller bearings) as well as the Borg Warner transfer cases which have chains, sprockets and chain tensioners.
I like the 'idea' of using ATF in my primary. It IS designed for use with clutch paks. But there's more going on in the primary than just the clutch. There's the primary chain and bearings and tensioner shoe and other stuff, too.
I'm going to shy away from it until somebody convinces me otherwise. The low viscosity of ATF has me concerned.
I'm going to shy away from it until somebody convinces me otherwise. The low viscosity of ATF has me concerned.
#43
07-03-2016, 10:35 PM
Extreme HDF Member
#44
07-03-2016, 11:10 PM
Extreme HDF Member
ATF in the primary accomplishes only one thing over Formula 2. It's lower viscosity allows the fluid to squeeze out from between the clutch plates faster. That causes less drag and improves the strength of the clutch plates contact.
Back around 2010 when H-D used lighter clutch springs to appease the whiners and wusses folks that had performance upgrades found that the clutch would slip some. Instead of going for the SE clutch spring and installation costs they used ATF and the clutch would not slip anymore.
Now you know the rest of the story.
Would ATF have any impact on the compensator or primary chain. That is unknown. My best guess is that with lower viscosity it may get into the compensator easier and that would be a good thing. I think the primary chain would not suffer under ATF use. But I don;t know.
Back around 2010 when H-D used lighter clutch springs to appease the whiners and wusses folks that had performance upgrades found that the clutch would slip some. Instead of going for the SE clutch spring and installation costs they used ATF and the clutch would not slip anymore.
Now you know the rest of the story.
Would ATF have any impact on the compensator or primary chain. That is unknown. My best guess is that with lower viscosity it may get into the compensator easier and that would be a good thing. I think the primary chain would not suffer under ATF use. But I don;t know.
#45
07-04-2016, 06:29 AM
#46
07-04-2016, 09:59 AM
Road Master
ATF in the primary accomplishes only one thing over Formula 2. It's lower viscosity allows the fluid to squeeze out from between the clutch plates faster. That causes less drag and improves the strength of the clutch plates contact.
Back around 2010 when H-D used lighter clutch springs to appease the whiners and wusses folks that had performance upgrades found that the clutch would slip some. Instead of going for the SE clutch spring and installation costs they used ATF and the clutch would not slip anymore.
Now you know the rest of the story.
Would ATF have any impact on the compensator or primary chain. That is unknown. My best guess is that with lower viscosity it may get into the compensator easier and that would be a good thing. I think the primary chain would not suffer under ATF use. But I don;t know.
Back around 2010 when H-D used lighter clutch springs to appease the whiners and wusses folks that had performance upgrades found that the clutch would slip some. Instead of going for the SE clutch spring and installation costs they used ATF and the clutch would not slip anymore.
Now you know the rest of the story.
Would ATF have any impact on the compensator or primary chain. That is unknown. My best guess is that with lower viscosity it may get into the compensator easier and that would be a good thing. I think the primary chain would not suffer under ATF use. But I don;t know.
You forgot to mention, the stuff they used in the primary before they started using synthetics was.......... automatic tranny fluid. It worked fine for many years despite all the horror stories and what if's from some.
#47
07-28-2017, 08:50 AM
Atf in primary
I run atf type f in my twincam primary, I change it more often than the other fluids simply because of the heat issue. In you car the ATF fluid is cooled by the radiator and in some cases an auxiliary trans cooler. As for lubrication of the chain and bearings, transmissions have bearings and in some instances (AWD) there are chains. The Viscosity of ATF is around 7.3 depending on the maker.
I also use Mercon ATF in my Fork tubes 7.3 is the viscosity of HD fork oil.
In my trans I use 75-90 weight gear oil, it is a transmission not an engine.
Clutch packs, chains and bearings = ATF
Gears and shifting forks riding on
bearing shafts = gear oil (I use synthetic)
Pistons, rods, crank pin,
valve train and so on = Motor oil
buying fluids from HD by HD = mo money.
I also use Mercon ATF in my Fork tubes 7.3 is the viscosity of HD fork oil.
In my trans I use 75-90 weight gear oil, it is a transmission not an engine.
Clutch packs, chains and bearings = ATF
Gears and shifting forks riding on
bearing shafts = gear oil (I use synthetic)
Pistons, rods, crank pin,
valve train and so on = Motor oil
buying fluids from HD by HD = mo money.
#48
07-28-2017, 09:20 AM
now I'm intrigued. I currently use the Red Line primary fluid and would like to stick with Red Line.
They have a ton of options, can anyone let me know which is best for a 6speed? https://www.redlineoil.com/Products.aspx?pcid=9
Possibly the High-Temp ATF?
They have a ton of options, can anyone let me know which is best for a 6speed? https://www.redlineoil.com/Products.aspx?pcid=9
Possibly the High-Temp ATF?
#49
07-28-2017, 09:36 AM
Extreme HDF Member
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#50
07-28-2017, 10:07 AM
Club Member
now I'm intrigued. I currently use the Red Line primary fluid and would like to stick with Red Line.
They have a ton of options, can anyone let me know which is best for a 6speed? https://www.redlineoil.com/Products.aspx?pcid=9
Possibly the High-Temp ATF?
They have a ton of options, can anyone let me know which is best for a 6speed? https://www.redlineoil.com/Products.aspx?pcid=9
Possibly the High-Temp ATF?
https://www.redlineoil.com/product.aspx?pid=120&pcid=13
