Well Mr. Perfect, aren't you a golden ray of sunshine.
Never made a mistake? Never trusted someone to do a job for you? Never made an assumption on anything?

So I made a mistake. At least I own it. It's my money, my time to make it right, and doesn't impose on you at all. But you still feel the need to make yourself look so much brighter by diminishing the light of another?

And just for your information, I didn't buy the KBs off the net and they were no where near the cheapest. I did my homework. I bought 'em because they could run with tighter clearances and run quiet. I bought 'em from the outfit that did the hone job that has an excellent reputation. They actually suggested Wisecos. I chose the KBs. They weren't that much cheaper. Yeah, it's apparent now I should have taken that advice too. When honing the barrels, it might be they err'd just on the side of being loose, because being too tight would CERTAINLY cause a problem.

So unless you have constructive opinions.....

 

Half a thou over, and it still cold rattles. Interesting. My Dodge pick-up did it too from the time it was new. well over 100,000 miles before selling it on.

I have a PowerVision tuner BTW.

If I do end up going bigger, and the cams don't work out, it's not a difficult swap and I'd imagine It'll be easy to find a buyer for this set.

I appreciate everyone's insight.

 

In setting the ring gap, assuming you did, I would think you would have noticed a loose fit on the pistons to cylinder?

Are you sure the "clatter" you hear isn't coming from the lifters, maybe the push rods weren't adjusted correctly?

After all, you aren't working on a VW drag race motor

 

Donnie makes a good point, might not be pushrod adjustment even. Maybe a squishy lifter that gives more and needs the push rod to be extended more? I just did a top end build as well and have some ticking in the front rocker box. I guess I don't know what piston slap sounds like.

 

I think Mike has figured out the problem; KB pistons probably setup loose. Valve train noise would likely increase as the motor reaches operating temps but piston slap goes away. Mike might be able to run the motor like that for many miles but unless he pulls it down and measures, he doesn't know how loose the fit is. Once torn down, he might as well go .020" over (I would go ahead to 95"/98") and maybe select a different piston. If .020" over, the SE cast flat tops are as good as any. Also a hypo piston, just needs to be fitted properly.

Forged pistons in my all bore 107"; forged don't setup as tight as cast hypo and they rattle a bit on cold start up but rattle gone by the time I get my gear on and get on the bike.

 

I did have to fit the rings, but I don't use a piston for that. The bore size is really close to my VW motor, so I use my "ring squaring tool" which is essentially a chunk of aluminum bar that I cut in my lathe into a "T" shape that squares it as it pushes the ring down 1" from the top of the bore. I went .022" top and .024" second - a little less than my VW motors.

The VW motor uses Wisecos at .006" skirt clearance, and they clatter enough to be heard over open exhaust, until gets some heat in the motor. I have the motor apart at the moment, and those pistons and barrels don't show a lick of wear. Maybe a couple hundred runs on 'em.

The S&S pushrods (40tpi) were set for .120" preload.

So essentially, yeah, I shoulda checked the skirt to wall clearance. But then I have to ask, how many home builders, once getting a set of pistons and barrels actually do check?

In the meantime, it's been raining nearly non-stop here in Central California for nearly two weeks. At the moment, I have my racer to get ready for the Bakersfield March Meet, and it's scattered about in quite a few pieces. So, I'm just gonna chew on the bike "problem" (if it is a problem) for a bit.

Looks like a window in the weather is gonna open up by the weekend, so I'll take 'er out on a little ride and then dump the oil. If it has any crap in it, then I'll deal with it fairly soon. If not, maybe I'll ride it for a while and monitor it. Most likely, I'll look at buying a piston and cylinder kit either from S&S, Zippers or maybe see if Hillcycle can supply it.

BTW, the valvetrain noise stays consistent regardless of temp. Before doing this work, it would clatter when it got hot. And after shutting down after a long ride, the lifters seemed to bleed down quickly and clatter like hell until oil pressure built up. I took djl's advice as well as others and went for the S&S lifters and adjustable pushrods, then going with the 509 cam. No lifter clatter at all on start-up now, and a pleasant low pitched whine from cam gears.

Question....Are the SE pistons a dealer item? I'd like to buy a piston/cylinder set outright and change 'em out when I have time. Who's the best to buy from, if not from those I mentioned?

Jay, piston slap sounds a lot like a muffled rod knock, coming in at light load, from just above idle when the motor is cold. It starts to quiet as heat builds, and usually disappears after a coupla minutes. A rod knock usually grows louder with heat and rpm, and gets worse very quickly the longer it's operated. A rock knock will leave a bunch of very visible particles in the oil as it eats into the crank, bearing and connecting rod.

 

If installing new cylinders and pistons, I always order pistons OS, or, in some cases order the cylinders with a specific bore diameter and have cylinders bored/honed to fit. I don't know about S&S or Zippers but MTC will prep cylinders to a specified bore diameter as well as spigot machined to a specific case bore application. IMHO, there is no such thing as a guaranteed and properly fitted cylinder/piston kit; just not worth taking the chance. Why not decide on bore diameter, order pistons and have your cylinders bored to fit? Or pick up a set of take off cylinders; cheap and plenty laying around. I probably have two sets laying around in the garage; I have heard some service managers will give them away or sell them real cheap. A capable machinist will bore the cylinders and fit pistons to manufacturers, or your, specifications, fit and gap the rings. All you need do is clean and prep the parts and install when ready.

SE pistons are a dealer item and the cast flat tops at $199.95 less the 20% discount from an online dealer like Surdyke, Boardtracker or Newcastle, not a bad deal and available in 3.875" or .010" OS bore. I am a CP fan; great quality and consistency and the piston assembly is very close in weight to the OEM piston assembly. A little more expensive than HD but available in several different compression ratios like 9.25 to 11. These are forged and, as you know, don't setup as tight as cast hypos.

I don't know who makes pistons for S&S or Zippers but I am pretty sure they are selling re-branded hardware.

 

I thought I would mention, Randy uses the CP pistons as well but only uses the full skirt pistons and never the slip skirt pistons as the full skirts are quieter. Something to consider.

 

Mike you obviously have skills to do the work. Have you maybe spoken with or taken the parts in question over to Chris Rivas or Bob @ RC to see what they have to say? Maybe have them get the pistons and do the fit. You have 2 pretty knowledgeable builders in your area to talk to and use if needed.

 

Rivas was who I used for this go-around.