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Oh yah, 15 seconds of inconvenience in the interest of saving the lives of innocent people is enough for you to take up arms. That's what I wanna die for. For God's sake, get a freaking life.
Yep, and the first folks I'll be shooting are folks just like yourself! The sheeple willing to degrade our countries heritage, so you can feel cozy!
I have family that have died to protect the rights you and I have and I'm not about to give them up!
I'll do what I'll do, you do what you do, that's what makes this the greatest country in the world....
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09'FXSTB 103"ci PRO Stage III kit, heavy breather,Thunder max W/auto tune
Yep, and the first folks I'll be shooting are folks just like yourself! The sheeple willing to degrade our countries heritage, so you can feel cozy!
I have family that have died to protect the rights you and I have and I'm not about to give them up!
I'll do what I'll do, you do what you do, that's what makes this the greatest country in the world....
It's pointless to argue with arm chair lawyers/revolutionaries who don't know the difference between a right guaranteed under our Constitution and a preference someone pulled out of their azz.
Let me repeat this very slowly. A properly conducted sobriety checkpoint is not an unreasonable search or seizure.
If you prefer they not be done, fine and dandy. But don't try to wrap your preference in the flag. You not only show your ignorance of the Constitution, you dishonor the sacrifice of those who fought and died for it.
Jimmers out
Last edited by jimmers1817; 07-24-2009 at 09:31 AM.
I'm all there, not to sure about some of you though?
I've never stopped for one and never will. I've simply driven around them.
If you think all american's are going to just stand for in justice's, History tells us, they won't! American's have killed for freedom and will do so again! it's just that simple..
I suggest some reading on american history, for our lesser informed members.
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09'FXSTB 103"ci PRO Stage III kit, heavy breather,Thunder max W/auto tune
Ok, enough of the constitutional legality debate. 39 states allow sobriety checkpoints, 11 do not because they believe it infringes on civil liberties.
So those states who allow checkpoints should have a higher drop in drunk driving deaths right?
Well, they don't. They all average about the same. Infact from 2003-2004 the nation saw a small decrease in alcohol related crashes...but 96% of them came from the 11 states that do no allow checkpoints. In truth, every one of the 11 states who deem checkpoints unconstitutional had a decrease in fatal dui-related crashes while nearly half of the states that allow them saw an increase in dui-related fatalities.
In the last 10 years drunk driving related deaths haven't changed all that much nationwide. Some states see slight decreases, some states see slight increases.
Now realize most of the problem stemming from drunk drivers are repeat offenders. Cops can only set up checkpoints in certain areas that allow them the space needed for the operation, places to pull cars to the side, etc. They are usually in the same general vicinity everytime. To quote a lot of peoples seeming hero on this board "Fool me once, shame on...shame on you. Ya fool me, you can't get fooled again."
Hence they will take a different way home. In 1997 a study was conducted in North Carolina showed that officers failed to catch over half the drivers who passed through with a BAC of .08% and higher.
"A 1995 National Highway Traffic Safety Administration evaluation of several DUI enforcement efforts showed that 80 percent of those surveyed were aware of the checkpoints — a deterrence to drunken driving, researchers concluded. Significantly fewer drivers were aware of saturation patrols, the study found."
You might argue that catching one or two drunk drivers out of thousands of vehicles stopped is a good use of a resources, but in reality it's not. Especially in the times we are in, we can't afford it.
What is a good alternative, the isn't debatable as an infringment on civil liberties?
Saturation patrols. They are much cheaper, much more cost effective, and can cover a lot of area unlike checkpoints. They can patrol area's where checkpoints can't, busy highways, city streets, etc.
They can catch people for anything and everything, but they are not allowed to pull them over without witnessing some kind of traffic violation, reckless driving, etc. There has to be probable cause.
This boads well with us as bikers. They can pull over idiots on the cell phones, speeders, unsafe drivers, reckless driving, traffic violations, etc.
"For example, from October 2006 through September 2007, Independence police spent $31,875 on checkpoints, where they stopped 3,091 cars and made 63 drunken-driving arrests and 66 arrests for other violations, including warrants and drug possession. That’s an arrest rate for all violations of about 4.2 percent at a cost of $247.09 for each arrest.
During the same time, they spent $81,878.54 on saturation patrols, where they stopped 2,253 cars and made arrests or wrote tickets for 2,575 violations, including 110 for drunken driving. That’s an arrest rate of 114 percent, at a cost of $31.79 per offense." -
"A U.S. Department of Transportation report concluded: “If making a large number of (drunken driving) arrests is an objective, (the data) clearly suggests that roving patrols would be the preferred method.”"
Typical Americans ARE sheep following what seems good and right, whatever the mass media tells them, they don't question things, they don't read into things. They think the government owes them something just for being born, no one wants to take responsibility for themselves. They vote for people who are good talkers and people who they want to have a beer with, hence the last 2 presidents. This is just another thing they are led to believe, just like all politicians who want to pass some rediculous law, bill, incentive "in the naaaaaaaaaame of jesus!"
If you bring religion into a public debate invoking response of people automatically not questioning it. Until America becomes less apathetic and more interested in their own lives and country instead of what xxxcelebrity is doing, who's wearing what, who's kissing who, what new video game kicks ass this country will continue to fall into the gutter and our empire will crumble from within just like every great empire before. Enemies do not defeat us, we defeat ourselves with blindness and stupidity.
Multiple sources all over the net, you want anymore you go find them.
The more I think about it, the more I've come to the conclusion that this is jsut a part of the 21st century life that we are all experienceing. We are in a global economy now, and will soon be a fully socialist state. The only choice that I REALISTICALLY see for me in the future, is to try to find a way to live. The younger generation is already fully indoctrinated, and in time, they will run the country.
Us guys that are 40+ that remember how it used to be, are now dinosaurs. The Left knows this, and knows that in time we will die off.
Hate to say it, but the writings on the wall.
Sobriety checkpoints are simply a reality of life.
Being a military man, I'm more accustomed to having Uncle Sam controlling me....the rest of you....."welcome to my world".
~Joe
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2005 H/D Superglide
"When I get where I'm going, I'll be there"
Dare to turn your own wrenches-Everybody had to start doing it at one time.
Only people that drink and drive (or ride) have a problem with checkpoints. There is an easy way for them to avoid them......stay off the road. I for one wish there were 100 times more checkpoints and I think if you are stopped and fail your ride should be taken forever as well as your license, 2nd offense 20 years in jail. There is no excuse for operating a vehicle under the influence, other than being retarded. Besides that, your operating privilege is just that, a privilege, not a right. Therefor your rights are not being violated.
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'08 FLHTCU
'04 FXDI
City Of Champions - Pittsburgh, PA
Last edited by ezriderpgh; 07-25-2009 at 02:28 AM.
Only people that drink and drive (or ride) have a problem with checkpoints. There is an easy way for them to avoid them......stay off the road. I for one wish there were 100 times more checkpoints and I think if you are stopped and fail your ride should be taken forever as well as your license, 2nd offense 20 years in jail. There is no excuse for operating a vehicle under the influence, other than being retarded. Besides that, your operating privilege is just that, a privilege, not a right. Therefor your rights are not being violated.
I take it you didn't even read my post 2 above yours? If you want to waste all those resources for a miniscule amount of arrests, then go ahead and pay for it, but certainly don't waste tax payers money on something that has been proven inefficient in more than one way.
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On the slow road to recovery.
Organized religions are the greatest fairytales ever told. Ignorance is bliss.
Let it happen. People don't need to be drinking and driving anyway!!
