Hey Gang,

I got an 04 Fat Boy, 95ci, 251 cams, Mikuni carb. Problems started around 15K and worsened...now at 18K miles. After reading this forum, I think I have a bad/disintegrating stator. I read about the original stators with the screws (vs weld) that back out and destroy the unit. I'm guessing it's either the stator or loose compensator/rotor. One mechanic told me to torque the compensator bolt to 200 ft/lbs. My bike starts fine using the choke, but after warm-up throws "bus err" code and starts making this terrible metal grinding sound coming from what seems to be the front of the primary. Bike will stall if you don't keep the RPMs up, and it runs rough. It is definitely not ridable in this condition. My bike's been down for almost a year. My dealer shop didn't have a clue...they had me replacing ICM, intake manifold sensor, and crank position sensor...none of which fixed the problem....won't be going back there except for hats and T's...

So I got the primary cover off and getting the sockets, etc to pull the compensator and clutch so I can get to the rotor/stator and have a look. There was no metal in the drained primary oil. Chain tensioner shoe has about 1/16" of wear. Primary chain alignment looks good. Chain could be tightened a little but it is not bad.

Is there anything else I should be doing/checking in the primary when I do this job? I will adjust the clutch while in there. I read on this forum about the new improved compensators. Not sure if there is one available for my '04 FB. Anything else I should inspect/replace while I'm in there?

After this job comes the cam tensioner check/fix....lots of fun ahead eh, ...and no riding for now...

Thanks all...
Regards

 

Good luck with the replacement of the stator/rotor assembly. Keep us posted on what you find as you tear into it. And if possible, post some photos to show what you find.

Bart

 

Bump....I'll be working on the primary this weekend. Any additional info is appreciated.

Regards

 

My experience is with the 06 Twin Cam, I do not know if the 04 is quite the same. However,
the stator and rotor replacement was not to difficult, try to do it with out removing the inner primary cover. I think that Mudpuddle had to lightly grind a clearance on his inner primary case to get the rotor off with out removing the inner primary case. Try this link, it shows the area that he had to remove. (You will need to scroll down some to see it.) You will just have to see what kind of clearance you have once you get in there. My service manual for the 06 lists 155-165 ft. lbs. of torque for the compensating sprocket and 70-80 ft.lbs. for the clutch hub main shaft nut.

https://www.hdforums.com/forum/testi...ste-400-a.html

 

Thanks guys. I have an update.

Well the Primary is apart in my garage. I was lucky to get the rotor off without loosening/removing the inner primary. I used 2 allen wrenches in the rotor cover holes and 2 vice grips. I had cleared the magnetic field and was getting ready to pull it past the inner primary when it just sort of slipped off by angling the rear aspect of the rotor out of that cavity first, and then the rest followed. I'm leary about grinding/narrowing that bearing surface on the inner primary case...I don't want to invite an oil leak.

I found that my compensator nut was at less than 100 Ft/lbs of torque when I began disassembly....this may be the basis for the problems I was having. I don't think the shop manual's instructions for "2 drops" of loctite red and 150-165 ft/lbs torque is enough for the compensator nut on a 95CI, 04 FB. When I reintall, I will run 2 beads of loctite across those long threads on the compenstator nut and torque it to maybe 180 ft/lbs to see if it holds.

The stator "looks" just fine...no bad puke smell that others have noticed with burnt stators. No visible burning or damage, just a little fine black dust on the contacts. I wiped it and rotor clean. I made the big mistake of not testing the stator/rotor output with a meter before taking things apart. I just assumed it was destroyed.

Question: Can I put the rotor back on with just the compensating sprocket/nut installed and run the bike on my stand without the primary cover, chain and clutch installed? I just want to run it for a few minutes to get a reading on the stator/rotor to determine if the stator is bad. It's either that or just install a new stator before I button 'er up.

So do you guys think the under torqued compenstator nut is my problem (remember my first post...I get "bus er" codes after the bike warms up at idle), or should I just assume it could be the stator as well and replace it? If indeed my stator is fine, could the loosened compensator nut result in "bus err" codes??....I assume the rotor has to keep spinning (it's on a spined shaft) even if the compensator nut is torqued under spec...and in that situation should not affect the stator/rotor output...would it??? Enough to throw a 'bus er' code?

I appreciate any replies. I'd like to get the parts I need and get 'er running for the 4th if possible...this bike has been sitting since last summer.

Also, any tool vendor suggestions? I have to get a 6 pt, 1/2" drive socket in 1 1/2" and return the one I borrowed. I'm having a hard time finding this socket in a 6 pt, 1/2" drive.

Thanks all...
Regards

 

I just tore mine apart yesterday. Go to Harbor Freight if there's one in your area. I doubt if they have a 1/2" drive, but they do have a 3/4" drive 1 1/2" cuz that's where I got mine. Mine is a 12 point, but it shouldn't matter, it's been workin' for me.

The Ultima manual for my engine says 165 ft lbs and that's what I torqued mine to last time. Use some carb cleaner to clean the threads on the comp nut and the crank threads. I used more than two drops of loctite, more like all the way around and prolly 5 or 6 threads deep. It stuck great, had a hell of a time gettin' it back off this time.

Hopefully you didn't find what I did.....two screws backed out of my stator and started chewin' on the rotor. The guy that assembled this engine originally apparently didn't believe in loctite.

I started finding 1/4" afro's on my drain plug every week (another long story) so I had to keep diggin' 'til I found something ferrous grinding.

Good luck

 

Two beads of red Locktite will make disassembly pretty difficult, I would not do it.

Can you start the bike without the clutch and primary chain? -No, the starter drives the clutch which drives the primary chain which spins the engine.

 

Frigid and Dan,

Thanks for your feedback.

Well I guess I asked the dumbest question of the month...eg, starting the bike w/o the primary chain in place.

My compensator nut was loose (less than 100 ft/lbs)...so I don't have much faith in HD's guidance for "2 drops of red loctite and 150-165 torque")...1 very qualified mechanic said loctite and torque to 200ft/lbs....another said they (Harley shop) use more loctite than the manual recommends and torque to 150-165...HD shops refuse to torque any higher.

My stator looks fine....screws in place...no metal filings in primary. I wondered if the loose compensator nut caused the metal grinding noise I would get after the bike reached running temp; and also cause the "bus er" code I was getting. I asked ths before but didn't get an answer. The code led me to think the problem was the stator. Could the loose compensator nut cause the output of the stator/rotor to drop enough to throw a code???

If I don't get an answer by EOB today, I'm calling to order a new stator before the weekend. I don't want to close it up and then find out the rotor is indeed bad.

Thanks again

Regards

 

Hey Gang,

I have an update on my primary/stator job for my 04 Fat Boy. I replaced the stator and reinstalled the drive chain, compensator, and clutch. Unfortunately, that was not my problem. I still get the metal grinding noise coming from the 'area' of the primary and "bus err" codes that I got before starting this job. The only finding in the primary during the job was a loose compensator nut (it was just below 100 ft/lbs).

I'm wondering if my problem isn't the cam shoe tension/wearing issue I've read about with the TC88's. I have 18K miles now. I've read here that some are wearing out below 20K. I have the 95 CI kit and 251 mid-range cam. That cam has a lot of lift. Could my cam have put additional stress on the cam/valve train system, causing premature wear?

The grinding noise is getting worse. It starts about 1-2 minutes into warm-up and is fairly constant. Haven't ridden my bike in a year. My dealer had it for a week last year and didn't fix it.

Could it be the oil pump? A bearing? Crankshaft bearing?

I know it's tough to diagnose over the forum, but what do you'all think? Cam/valve train issue or worse (some bearing low in the motor?). I dread the latter, and a major engine job...especially at 18K miles.

So I'd like to hear from people with '04 TC88's or similar with 18K or more miles. Are any of you experiencing similar problems with your bikes? Is it me or does it seem like it's mostly guys with newer bikes (and no real problems yet) that account for most of the activity on this forum?

I'm frustrated and my bikes done at 18K miles. I called the moco...no insights there and no recalls...just recommendations to other 'dealers'. I'm reluctant to take it to another HD "dealer" given my dealer's track record.

You guys recommended some indy's in my area. Guess this is the best option for now. I will need an independant to document the issues in case this turns out to be a major motor overhaul...I shouldn't have to pay for that at 18K, warrranty notwithstanding!! Have any of you had to lawyer-up to the moco for major issues on low-mileage bikes?? I'm hoping it doesn't lead to this...

I would appreciate anyone's feedback...on the potential problem or for recommendations to proceed with diagnosis by an indy mechanic....and then action against the moco by a lawyer if needed ...whatever....).

Thanks all...
Regards

 

If your compensator nut was loose it is a possibility that the roller bearing on the sprocket shaft is damaged.

Pull it apart again and remove the sprocket shaft spacer and have a good look at the shaft bearing.

To prevent a loose compensator, get a better clamp load on the spring pack by removing .050 from the snout of the nut or use a .050 spacer under the hex head of the nut.