Had Cheyne at V&H send me a custom map for my 103" after installing Andrews 57H cams. Running catless 2-1-2 with 2.5" baffles. After the install and running an auto-tune with the fp3, I had this annoying hesitation after warmup from a stop. Turns out the problem was "throttle progressivity". Went from moderate back to normal/stock throttle.....problem solved.
I'm sure there's more to be had from the bike with TTS or PV and a dyno run. However, right now I'm happy to have the hesitation gone. I'm a little rich which makes for a cooler running engine. Longer warmup, but no lean condition at all. Bike pulls STRONG in all RPM ranges thru all gears.......I'll eventually get a dyno tune, but even then I don't believe a huge improvement will happen.

 

Yep...
Same on my 96" Stage 2 with Andrews 48h
I have my TP set to aggressive and only experienced it during the first auto tune.
My ? to you...
I can only get orange cells after 3 days on the same auto tune session.
V&H says it's still learning and flash the auto map anyway. Throwing codes for rich front and rear cylinders.
It did run a bit better after the flash but second session so far is still all orange..
No green..and still throwing codes.
They say run the second session and flash regardless of color and hit finish.
Bothers me that I don't see any green "learned" cells

 

I had the same problem the last time I ran a/t on my Breakout and was told the same thing from V&H. I never did get any green cells but hit finish anyways. The bike actually ran better on the base map, so I flashed back....I was going to try flashing a new/same base map and trying a/t again, but haven't done it yet. I agree, it doesn't seem right not getting any green cells, It worked fine the first few times I ran it........

 

FP3 will only change VE by a maximum of 15% in a single AT session.

If you are getting too rich errors logged (I did too when I was trying different things) then your starting map is WAAAAY off.

If you keep clicking apply it may pull it in closer and then you may start getting green cells but all the time it will stink of petrol and you are probably washing down the cylinders.

Especially when you start putting cams in, I don't think the V&H canned maps are close enough as a starting map ...just my 2c

Even if you do get some of the cells to go green ...what about the ones around the edge of their "football" shaped learned area??

BTW ...my Too Rich errors were when I put the 57H and ProPipe on!!!!

 

If I don't see green cells, or at the very least, a session with no codes after the next AT session I'll get the stage 1 map and tune from there.

My understanding as far as the unlearned cells outside the "football" is that the FP3 uses an algorithm to "guess" what proper A/F is at those cells.
I am not a tuning or FP3 expert by any stretch of the imagination, so I could be wrong

 

mmm, not sure about that?
How would the map know which VE cells were "tuned" and which were not?

The FP3 is just a flash tuner. Once your map is tuned and flashed, the FP3 plays no further part in the running of the ECU ...it can be removed from the bike.

The algorithm I think is mentioned is the one in the delphi code that works out a best guess for AFR cells that are in Open-loop, based on what it is seeing for short and long term learned values that are derived from the O2 sensor Closed-loop feedback

 

Potato Potaato..
Sounds very much like what I said.
Uses an algorithm from what it learns from O2 sensors.
Update from V&H.
They say run 3 seperate 1 hr sessions and send the map in for analysis.
They also suggested this

"Please start a new AutoTune Advance session and change the O2 Voltage to 0.7V and see if that fixes the issue."
Not quite sure what an advance session is but my app made me quit the current auto tune session and download an updated version.
Ill have to look into more tomorrow.

 

Sorry, what I was trying to get across is that the algorithm recalculates open-loop cells based on how far off the closed-loop ones are.

In other words the whole table has to be tuned properly to start with. Then, on the "assumption" that the VE in the open-loop areas are actually tuned they will be adjusted by the algorithm, sort of by the same amount as the closed-loop areas are currently found to be out (based on the CLI/AFF)

If your cells are not properly tuned to start with then all bets are off. You need as many green cells as you can possibly manage ...same with any tuner, narrowband or wideband etc etc

does that make sense.

 

Ya, I was playing with the FP3 today, and noticed for the first time, that you can now choose either "Quick Setup" or "Advanced Setup" under AutoTune. The advanced has Start Engine Temp, Desired AFR, 02Voltage, and Number of Samples...and you can change the #s for each.

 

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