Just bought a brand new Road King in Vivid Black, love the new bike, I have a question though. I have heard many bike owners say that anytime you modify the exhaust of any bike from stock, you have to add a programmer, or re-map the fuel system to match the subsequent tuning change the free flowing exhaust will add. Is this true?? I would like to add 4.5 inch Vance and Hines Monster Rounds, along with Their power header system. Can I do this without adding a programmer?? Thanks....

 

if you have a 2014 or 2015 you will likely need tuning compensation to compensate for the increased flow allowed by your headers.

there are a number of options- so suggest you read up.

I am using nightrider.com xieds on my 09- they work, they are cheap, I know what they do.


Other guys might want to get more in depth and have more refined and expensive devices--- the results are dependent on the owner and how smart they are.

in any case you will gain 7 to 10 horsepower over stock.

if you have a 2013 or earlier- you can likely change to the headers and mufflers without tuning- the air cleaner is more restrictive than the 2014+ version.
But you leave that 7 to 10 HP laying on the table...the Ness Big Sucker hi flow intake is about $130 on ebay from easternpc ( chome backing plate version) a good bang for buck- with that you would also need tuning.

welcome to the forums, hang out and read up- see what makes sense to you.

a "Stage 1" can cost a few hundred bucks for cheep DIY Guys like me...to $2000 for guys who have the dealer pick it up, drop it off and pay full boat for everything.

we have a very active classifieds board- the restrictions on use tend to give us some honest sellers and better deals for buyers

https://www.hdforums.com/forum/touring-parts-121/

there is at least one set of V&H monster ovals for sale ( I have no connection to this):

https://www.hdforums.com/forum/touri...ter-ovals.html


one last thought....many of these changes violate your factory warranty ( or an Extended Warranty)
your dealer may tell you otherwise ( if you buy from them)- ask them to put that in writing.
The dealer cannot modify the terms of the factory warranty.
They may wish to extend you their warranty- so get that in writing.

mike

 

The need to tune is really minimal with just the addition of slip ons. However, you really should consider it with the addition of the new head pipe. There are a number of tuner options available to do this, as suggested, read up on the options available.

I will say that in my area, the dealers have installed dynos and really push for the 4 hours of dyno time and the addition of a programmable tuner. "They" say this is the only way of getting the appropriate tune for your bike. I say this is their way of paying for their dyno while putting unnecessary full throttle pulls on your bike.

My two cents, wish I had some experience with dynos and aftermarket tuners

 

In General... what you have been told is true... However... there are exhaust mufflers which will change the note/sound that do not require a download or tune.

I have a 2009 103 and I changed the exhaust mufflers (keeping the header) and the bike ran like *****. Hesitation and pinged.

 

just mufflers, no tune unless the bike runs noticeably poor

full exhaust(headers and mufflers) you need tuner.

 

If I've typed it once, I bet I've typed it 20 times...

The FIRST thing a man should do when considering making changes is GET A TUNER. It will help a stock bike, and when you change pipes and or air cleaner, you're ready for it.

Can you run without a tuner? Yes.

Will you blow your engine up running without a tuner? Probably not.

Can you expect to get 50,000 miles out of your engine without a tuner? Most likely.

Will it run correctly without a tuner? No.

Dealers and their parts and service departments are a business, in business to sell motorcycles, and motorcycle parts and accessories. They tell you that you can get away without a tuner, because a LOT of guys won't come off the jack for a tuner, and they're afraid they'll lose sales if they tell you to get a tuner.

Changing the air flow without changing the VE tables is not beneficial. These bikes run lean from the factory, adding a more free flowing exhaust makes them run more lean.



Do what you want, I won't criticize, just trying to offer things to think about.

...but there is a reason I won't buy a used bike as my primary ride...

 

Congrats on the new RK! Here's my totally un-biased opinion. You don't need a tuner, you don't need pipes, you don't need mufflers. You got a black RK, you got 50HP more than the other guys, yer gonna blow the doors off everyone else right outta the box, no need to embarass them anymore.

 

Well said and couldn't agree more...

 

If you are changing your headpipe, you are removing the catalytic converter (a good thing) and that will change your flow enough that you will at least need a map downloaded from HD. I would not do what you are suggesting without a tuner though. You will also want to go with a stage 1 breather to get more air flowing into the engine to take advantage of the increased breathing capacity of the new pipes. This combo will bring you a nice bump in power and torque. You may or may not want to make mods later (such as a cam like many of us do) and you will want a tuner at that time anyway. So, my suggestion is to get a tuner now and have the ability to get that motor dialed in nicely. There are many out there, HD SEPST, Power Vision, TTS Master-Tune, Power Commanders - several others. Lots of options..... there is a forum on here just for tuners and tuning also. Forums>Harley Davidson Tech and Mechanical/Ignition/Tuner/ECM/Fuel Injection. Have a look there if you decide you want to buy one. Two major differences in the tuners - those that make changes directly to your ECM and those that are an add-on device. I chose the HD SEPST (Harley Pro Super Tuner) which is essentially a dongle that allows you to make changes directly to your ECM. Welcome to the forum and good luck with your choices. You have a lot of very knowledgeable folks on here that are also very helpful.

 

No one has said anything so far that I could argue against, including CRocks. That said, it is hard not to monkey with the HD exhaust system for some reason. If nothing else, just for a better sound. My previous bike had a stage 1 upgrade with a power commander and professional tune. It ran perfect and had great power. On my '14 street glide I have de-catted stock pipes, SE air cleaner, and V&H slip ons. I went with the V&H Fuel Pak 3 tuner with auto tune and I am more than happy. The downloaded map from V&H ran fine with no decal pop and smooth power. I ran the auto tune a couple of sessions of about 200 miles each and got even better power and smoother idle. Will the FP3 auto tune do as well as a professional dyno tune? No. But if you don't need every single ounce of extra horse power, etc. then the FP3 will get you pretty darn close to perfect. I am sold on the FP3 and the results I get. You did not mention air intake, but my dealer said that no tuner was necessary unless you increase the air intake. The pipes and mufflers won't do much other than sound if you leave the stock intake. You will have higher air flow capability on the outbound side, but if you don't increase the intake flow that won't change much. IMO, you do need to get some sort of tuning done if you change the pipes and air intake. For just slip on mufflers, no need.