Starter Doesn't Work- a cure for the "Common Post"
#1
10-14-2016, 01:12 PM
Starter Doesn't Work- a cure for the "Common Post"
A how to:
1st you need a charged battery- a charged battery requires a ...charger. Not a tender.
A tender is intended to maintain a charged battery ( tend) not charge.
Once discharged ( "I left my lights on"/ "my alarm sounded the whole way from New York to Sturgis" )- a battery will only recharge to about 60% of it's previous capacity. It will never come back as good as new.
Do that twice and you have 100 CCA not 250 CCA*
Jumping a duff battery from a car can work- but once running the charging systems may be stressed by the load of the bad battery and your stator or regulator could fail- pulling the fuse for the headlight ( non-led) can drastically reduce the electrical strain- but be aware you will be invisible.
security system- set and know your own PIN- then if the fob doesn;t work for any reason you can start your bike
electrical problem:
The starter system has 2 parts a secondary system ( the starter motor) and a primary system ( all the switches, wiring, relay)
To bypass the primary system, remove the green wire from the solenoid- make SURE the bike is in neutral.
touch a wire from the battery + to the terminal on the solenoid and the starter will run
(for ease make a wire with a terminal ( to attach to solenoid) on one end and touch the other end to the 12volt + ( recessed) plug on your battery tender pigtail)
If at this point the starter does not run, and the battery is good- crack and retighten the starter mounting bolts to ensure a good ground.
after that you check the battery cables- both ends clean and tight.
If the starter does turn but the motor doesn't start- ign switch on, kill switch to run, security system, ECM/Tuner and main relay can each be a factor. These all control spark and fuel delivery
This will solve 90% of problems and a jumper wire in the saddlebag will solve a roadside problem- the real key is understanding how the system works and being smarter than a broken wire or bad connection
Mike
* a discharged battery will sulphate- details here-
http://www.progressivedyn.com/battery_basics.html
there will always be outliers and luck- but don;t count on a discharged battery being reliable as a one that has never discharged
1st you need a charged battery- a charged battery requires a ...charger. Not a tender.
A tender is intended to maintain a charged battery ( tend) not charge.
Once discharged ( "I left my lights on"/ "my alarm sounded the whole way from New York to Sturgis" )- a battery will only recharge to about 60% of it's previous capacity. It will never come back as good as new.
Do that twice and you have 100 CCA not 250 CCA*
Jumping a duff battery from a car can work- but once running the charging systems may be stressed by the load of the bad battery and your stator or regulator could fail- pulling the fuse for the headlight ( non-led) can drastically reduce the electrical strain- but be aware you will be invisible.
security system- set and know your own PIN- then if the fob doesn;t work for any reason you can start your bike
electrical problem:
The starter system has 2 parts a secondary system ( the starter motor) and a primary system ( all the switches, wiring, relay)
To bypass the primary system, remove the green wire from the solenoid- make SURE the bike is in neutral.
touch a wire from the battery + to the terminal on the solenoid and the starter will run
(for ease make a wire with a terminal ( to attach to solenoid) on one end and touch the other end to the 12volt + ( recessed) plug on your battery tender pigtail)
If at this point the starter does not run, and the battery is good- crack and retighten the starter mounting bolts to ensure a good ground.
after that you check the battery cables- both ends clean and tight.
If the starter does turn but the motor doesn't start- ign switch on, kill switch to run, security system, ECM/Tuner and main relay can each be a factor. These all control spark and fuel delivery
This will solve 90% of problems and a jumper wire in the saddlebag will solve a roadside problem- the real key is understanding how the system works and being smarter than a broken wire or bad connection
Mike
* a discharged battery will sulphate- details here-
http://www.progressivedyn.com/battery_basics.html
there will always be outliers and luck- but don;t count on a discharged battery being reliable as a one that has never discharged
Last edited by mkguitar; 10-14-2016 at 05:18 PM.
#3
10-14-2016, 01:57 PM
*snip*
Once discharged ( "I left my lights on"/ "my alarm sounded the whole way from New York to Sturgis" )- a battery will only recharge to about 60% of it's previous capacity. It will never come back as good as new.
Do that twice and you have 100 CCA not 250 CCA
*snip*
Mike
Once discharged ( "I left my lights on"/ "my alarm sounded the whole way from New York to Sturgis" )- a battery will only recharge to about 60% of it's previous capacity. It will never come back as good as new.
Do that twice and you have 100 CCA not 250 CCA
*snip*
Mike
#4
10-14-2016, 05:49 PM
Stellar HDF Member
#5
10-14-2016, 07:18 PM
If your battery works, that is the first step to starting your bike.
Some riders skip or do not understand this part.
If your tests and experience say good, then proceed.
Some tenders will show a battery as "charged" when it may be unable to hold a charge- what the tender is really experiencing is that the battery is "at capacity" & will not accept a charge.
Mike
Some riders skip or do not understand this part.
If your tests and experience say good, then proceed.
Some tenders will show a battery as "charged" when it may be unable to hold a charge- what the tender is really experiencing is that the battery is "at capacity" & will not accept a charge.
Mike
Last edited by mkguitar; 10-14-2016 at 07:27 PM.
#6
10-14-2016, 09:28 PM
Seasoned HDF Member
I have never heard that before. Nor has it shown up when I have recharged dead batteries, if the battery returns back to 12.6 or better. Definitely not my experience for quality AGM batteries I have 'brought back' from the dead. For one example, A customer found a battery they had forgotten about, and brought it to a shop. I tested it, and showed nothing. So we put it on a 10AMP automatic battery charger overnight. I know it was used in a bike ridden daily for 2 years after 'recovery'.
A quality AGM battery, especially a deep cycle AGM, is far more forgiving of deep discharge cycles...
On my boat, I used lead acid starting batteries for the mains/generator, but paid extra for AGM deep cycle as house batteries for that very reason.......
#7
11-05-2016, 01:37 PM
I have never heard that before. Nor has it shown up when I have recharged dead batteries, if the battery returns back to 12.6 or better. Definitely not my experience for quality AGM batteries I have 'brought back' from the dead. For one example, A customer found a battery they had forgotten about, and brought it to a shop. I tested it, and showed nothing. So we put it on a 10AMP automatic battery charger overnight. I know it was used in a bike ridden daily for 2 years after 'recovery'.
Agree & your correct.
I have experienced the same you have 1st hand over the past 4.5 decades wrenching my own bikes with agm batteries along with bikes i maintain for other people running agm's in their bikes too.
The reason why your seeing that is the fact TODAYS newer gen (QUALITY!/for ex-Yuasa & Deka!) AGM lead acid bike batteries tech BY DESIGN:
* Can endure significantly more/deeper discharge & recharge cycles with little loss in battery performance (minimal reduction in max voltage,CCA's or AH's) vs older gen std lead acid battery tech that would suffer more battery perf loss in same cond.
* Can go longer without charging due to having considerably less discharge when sitting (unloaded) vs older gen std lead acid battery tech does in same cond.
* Has less sulfation vs older gen std lead acid battery tech in same cond.
* Is more resistant to vibration & heat then older gen std lead acid battery tech in same cond.
* More powerful (CCA's & AH's) vs older gen std lead acid battery tech.
* Much less likely to spill/leak acid due to AGM design using much less acid/electrolyte vs older gen std (FLOODED) lead acid battery tech that utilizes considerably more acid/electrolyte.
Scott
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