I'm debating on whether or not to get a 95" stage II upgrade on the '06 ultra classic I'm getting in Jan. I've pretty much decided that unless I get major head work done at the same time, I'll be wasting money. I think that a 203 cam, bigger breather and SE exhausts, along with a power commander, perhaps, will be fine. My stock 88' softtail has a mikuni carb, 204 cam and V/H staggered big shots and puts out 84.6 HP and 92.6 torque. In other words, it's just fine without the bigger motor. Any comments?...Thanks.

 

apehog
Once again opinions will vary but I think your on the rite track. Camshafts are a major compromise from the factory so they make a worthy upgrade as long as they are chosen wisely. It looks like a well chosen path. I also agree unless you are going to improve the heads then skip the 95" The heads don't need alot to be worthy of the 95" just they would be the shortcoming of the upgrade if you don't tweak them a little.

Rich

 

Curious. Since you will be pissing ~<2 years of factory warranty away and want power, why haven't you considered going with the SE 103" stage 1 kit. The kit comes with cams and heads. 100 ft-lbs of torque would be sweet. $3,000 doesn’t seem that steep for ~100 HP/ 100 ft-lbs.

 

Did you have your softail Dyno'd ? 84.6 HP & 92.2TQ Sounds like a lot for an 88", The guy that did my bike has been building bikes and Dynoing them for years and said 79HP and mid 80"sTQ is about all your going to get out of an 88" with stock heads. I don't know for sure but he could been feeding me a line of crap, but I doudt it he is pretty well known around here.
I did S&S 510G cams, S&S carb, and with the power robbing Rineharts I only got 74.6HP & 84.4TQ my dad did the same cams, & carb but had Vance & Hines duals with Thunderheader slip-ons and got 76HP & 86TQ
I had my RK bored to 97" with Head work and same cams, and got 93.3HP & 103.4TQ with the Rineharts. Now have 2-1 Thunderheader and power went to 97.7HP & 104.6TQ their was a big improvement from the 88" to 97" and With the Thunderheader the power is night and day compared to the Rineharts. The shop told me that I would get about 20 more HP & TQ with the head work and BB 97" I wish I had your numbers before the BB work then I would be at 104HP and 104TQ that would make me alot more.

 

I had 203 cams installed in my motor when they put on a chrome kit before I took delivery of my bike, I also have a PCIII usb installed and the stage 1 download with the SE ac kit, my bike now has 1900 miles on it, I have not had it dynoed but a freind of mine had his fatboy dynoed, they just put in gear drives and a 37g cam in and it pulled 79hp and 80tq and I pulled away from him racing up a long grade, so I don't no what to tell ya, I am very satisfied with mine.
Oh yea, I have a set of rush mufflers installed with the rush baffles pulled, I put Thunder Monster baffles in the pipes just before the mufflers slip on, gave me the sound of a tru dual and the kick *** performance of a good scavenging system.

Hope this helps.

 

Tn.Heritage if your friend only has 80TQ then I would hope you could pull away from him. I'm sure your bike has more then 80TQ. When my dad and I rode together he had just 2 more TQ and his bike could walk away from mine in any gear.

 

I would ask what the difference is in the two exhausts as well.

Ask an experienced Dyno-tech what the biggest mistake guys make when upgrading their motors is...he'll tell you, mis-matched parts. If you think you want more power, (I did, so don't get me wrong), take the time and money to get parts that work well together and do it right. What kind of TQ do you want, where in the power band do you want the TQ?

Earlier stated, you're losing a warrantee in the deal, so you might as well do it right...to get the most bang for your buck, you may have to spend a little more, but, you'll get the most out of each individual part.

A well tuned and matched 95" will run with a poorly tuned and matched 103"...money wise, and bang for the buck, my research showed a 95" or a 98" kit will get you everything you need...going on a return for the dollar basis.

Mac

 

gsparesa
Warranty is more of a concearn for some people than others. It is also a grey area in some instances. As for the 103 kits for $3000 then labor also goes up bigtime to install this because now you must pull the engine and split the cases. For the 95-98 inch kits you can leave the engine in and only pull the top end. For cams you don't even have to pull the fuel tank if you also opt for the push rods.

If apehog goes with his plan "203 cam, bigger breather and SE exhausts" The breather and pipes are no concern for warranty and if the dealer installs the cams there should be no real concern for warranty with his servicing dealer. Other Dealers?

He does still have to think about tuning and I almost hate to bring that up at this time. But-there is the basic 1550 stage II flash that would be for that combination short of the extra 7 cubes, this would be in the ball park. I me and only myself would go SERT for tuning this combination. If he were to go for the dealer flash it would only be in the ball park and need a Power Commander or a race fueler or other add-on device to tune it in. Dollars for the Flash and the PC = The Sert. Don't get me wrong I also like the PC and you could tune it in fine with it using the stock ECU. I just think the stock ECU rev limit could use a little increase. For that it means Flash, SERT or aftermarket ECU. If your okay with the factory rev limit then a PC and a dyno tune from a Dynojet tuning center that has a 250 series dyno with the extra software to perform the auto tuning would work fine.

Rich

PS: a side note on the SERT in my spare time I will be working on way way to Virginize the SERT so if you have one and no longer have the bike you would be able to use it again.`I will post more on that when I have more information. If you have experience with Atmega8 AVR and working with ISP programing please contact me.

 

The Rev limiter is bumped to 6200 RPM on a stage I download......although the SERT allows for a more adjustable redline, you do get a little more, as i believe stock redline is 5,800 RPM.

The 1550 kit gives TORQUE. The ported heads is a horsepower thing..........so, you can have the heads ported for about $500 bucks, drop in a Andrews T-37 gear drive cam setup (good torque/bagger cam from what I hear), and then PC it.

Gear drive is nice in that you get away from the follower wear out problem down the road.

I'm dyno'ed at 78 horsepower / 78 Torque on my TC88, and mine is an 88" (stock heads and pistons, 8.6 to 1 CR) with S&S510G cams w/ SE Chromoly quick fit pushrods, S&S mufflers, Arlen Ness Big Sucka intake, Stage I download, PC III USB, SE gear down kit and pressure plate). Because my scooter is a stripped down Superglide, I have plenty of juice with the 88, but if mine were a bagger, I'd go with the bigger slugs to help offset the extra weight. Mac has the T-37's with 98 slugs and I believe soem head work......probably lost a little MPG, but he says he's got PLENTY of power now.....

I absolutely KNOW i could get an 88 above my power levels with some ported heads, and some domed pistons, but it would be at a higher RPM than a 1550/95". Extra cubes is ALWAYS a good thing, and flattops are nice becasue it'll run better on the crap they call pump gas!!

joe

 

P.S. If you can afford it, a 103 with be the "cats ***" in my humble opinion, with Gear driven cams of course, and a PC III!!!!![8D]

joe