I'm not aware of any cat in my 09 Trike

 

Guys check the mufflers. HD has been putting a cat in the right muffler for a couple of years. 2010 is the first that I have seen a cat in the header pipe. They did that to make it harder to get rid of the Cat. Most of us changed the mufflers out anyway and did not know we were getting rid of the cat.

 

I'm glad to see ya'll got money to burn, but I'm not sure why you need to do it. I live in Montana where 90% of the pumps only sell 91 octane fuel. We do have temps in the 90's (occasionally 100's) but I've never really experienced the frying legs I hear of so much. I've seen data from state fuels experts explaining that at the altitude most of MT and many other western states are at is the reason why 91 octane fuel more than equal in burn quality as 93 octane at sea level. That's why our regular fuel is only 85 octane and runs fine in 85% of todays cars. I do not have a temp guage on either current ride but did have one on my prior FLHTCUSE 103. It was the dipstick version but even when riding in 105 degree temps I only once or twice saw any reading of over 235 and I think that was during a parade in near 100 degree air temps. And that 103 did put some heat in your face at the lights. Seems to me more than I'm getting from the 09 SE110 or the 2010 XXX I have now. But I must admit we've had very few days over 92 this summer.

As far as torque, the cams in the 96 Harleys in my opinion put more TQ available in the right range than any stock Harley I've seen in the past 20 years and still get some pretty decent fuel mileage. My 103 with D&D 2-1 and Doherty intake required a SERT to run decent at all, and even then was very cam oriented. By this I mean the bottom end was actually a little weaker until you got enough rpm the wake up the cams. It would've sucked in 6th gear too if it had had one, where the current bikes actually do fairly well in my experience. One thing I've done on every Harley is change the mufflers and that alone have in every case smoothed the throttle response in various degrees. Some more than others. One mistake I've made at least once and others make very often is putting exhaust on that are too open (and LOUD) resulting in lost bottom end TQ. When you do that you will HAVE to change the intake flow (more free flowing filter), which in turn will require fuel mapping to get that TQ back where it belongs. And you'll still be lucky if you get it all back at the bottom end.

 

The stock mufflers on my 09 TG the right side muffler looks different then the left side if you look inside it. I had SE mufflers for a 07 put on no cats in them only rated for 49 states. The SE 50 state mufflers have cats in them . Had the SE air filter installed gets rid of that stock plastic box that blocks air getting to the cylinder fins on the right side, Also a sert with the download. the TG runs cooler better all around. I don't feel the heat on my right leg like I did before the mods. What Im concerned on the 2010 TG & SG is the oxygen sensor. is a two wire. Will changing the engine pipe to a non cat effect things. When I get time I want to find if the engine pipe part numbers are the same or different for a 09 TG and a 10 TG That will tell me for sure if the 09 TG has a cat in the engine pipe.

 

carlo, looking at the part number will not tell you if the 09 has a cat in the pipe. The bungs/o2 sensors were different between the 2 years. that alone would produce a different part number. The 09 bungs are near the heads in each pipe have a 2 wire o2 with a larger bung opening. The 2010 the o2 bungs are at the collector area with smaller 4 wire o2s. The cat is in the collector area of the 2010. I BELIEVE the cat was in the right muffler on the 09.

 

Thanks diden't realize that. Wonder if the cat can be punched out. Is this EPA stuff on the 2010 for 50 State or to make the State of Cal happy? I guess the 2010 Touring models have a cat in the collector also.

 

I think they did something different starting in 07 vs the 06 MY. My 06 FLHTCUI cam with a cat in the right muffler, it was heavy as hell and you could see it. I believe starting in 07 they used a coating in the right muffler vs the solid core. The coating allowed them to tune the exhaust for better sound. The 06's sounded like a VW vs the 07 sounding more Harley like. The 09 Triglide sold in every state except California did not come with a cat in the head pipes, the 2010's have the cat in the head pipes now. Of course all CVO's came with cats starting in MY 06 and still have them irregardless of the market their sold in.

 

I thought I was correct but needed the confirmation, I know don't know if the tech really don't know and understand the product they sell or was just telling me anything in order to blow me off. Being purposely vague is one thing, being that far off base tells me they will go as far as MOCO to deny a heat related problem caused by that CAT.

What gets me is the attitude they have that the buying public is so stupid you can tell them anything at the moment to placate them and shove them out the door without a serious attempt to resolve problems. They insult your intelligence as they **** on your leg and tell you it just raining. It should be required they read this and other forums to get an idea of the technical expertise reqired to work around thier built in problems.

It will come down to how the new 02 sensors and ECM react to a Cat being removed. If we had the old 19mm two wire from last year I would go ahead and destuff that headpipe. I am of the opinion it has to work in a heated environment from where they stuck it in the headpipe. How it reacts with the ECM when taken out of a high heat environment will tell us what we need to know. The least expensive way I feel would be to wait until somone replaces the 2010 Headpipe with the fuelmoto and see if it will tune. I am getting a feeling that fuelmotto is making that pipe with both sets of O2 sensor bungs for a purpose. Why would they include both the 19mm bungs and the 12mm bungs in the replacement pipe? I am hoping they put the new 12 mm O2 bungs up close to the heads so we can put them back in a heated environment. Just extend the wires and we should be good to go. It would be an expensive proposition to remove the Cat material on a 2010 only to find you created a whole new host of drivability problems and could not get a MAP/Tune to fix it. As someone said, it will be the first one off the iceflow to see what happens unless somone with a good technical understanding of how the new O2 sensor works and will react when the cat stuffing is removed post's the info.

I would hold off until after Oct. until someone takes the plunge, at least with the fuelmoto pipe you will have your original headpipe to stick back on. I imagine it will require an O2 sensor change out, either back to the old 19mm 2 wire or a varient. I have not been able to find out if the 2010 ECM is different from the 09 or just an 09 with a new program. That information in itself would point us in the right direction as far as what we will have to do if we remove the CAT.

 

I don't know why fuelmoto would just now be developing "due in Oct" a head pipe with out the cat if the 09 had one. I told the man the only cats in 09 were Cali, CVO and export models but he asssured me the 09 Tri Glide had the cat also. I got to find another service dept.

They head pipe for 09 has a different size bung than the 2010;

My dealer parts guy assured me that the cat was in the muffler and that putting Screaming Eagle muffs on would eliminate the cat. How is that for no knoledge,

 

Checking with a tech and am of the opinion the new 12mm o2 sensor may operate in it's present position with the cat material removed without sending a no heat code. If there is a little drivability problem I could put the o2's back up close to the head as the old 19mm o2 sensors were on the 09 Tri Glide. I will take an IR Temperature gun and measure the heat in the present position of the 02 sensors close to the cat and then move up toward the head and take readings to find the spot where the temperature is approxamately the same. The ECM should work with the 02 sensor if it is heated and not care where it is in the exhaust system as long as it is in the proper heat environment.

I would like to leave the o2's in their present position to keep from drawing unwanted attention to the headpipe. I wonder if the fuelmotto pipe leaves the 12mm o2 sensors in the same position. They are going to have both o2 senors bungs in them, the old 19mm and the new 12mm sensors and I bet they leave them in their same relative position as they were in the original pipes. I have rounded up some weldable 12mm bungs and if they don't work in the original position I will find them a home in the pipe that is warm enough for them.

On a side note the Jagg 10 row oil cooler and the Lenale fan should be on all Tri's from the factory and a high capacity oil pan in my opinion. My dealership was so impressed with the fan they are going to start stocking them, they asked me about it after discovering it when I took mine in for the 1000 mile service. The trike is so much heavier than an Ultra Classic Bike that extra thought should have been put into keeping the harder working engine cool, especially after adding that Cat in 2010. I know Harley makes a parade fan but it is larger and a little gaudy, the Lenale is not much bigger than the horn cover it replaces and most owners will like the look better than the large Harley Fan.