Sitting there in hot weather traffic...
Login  | |
|
Sitting there in hot weather traffic... - 5/20/2008 2:58:57 AM
|
|
|
99octane
Posts: 945
Joined: 12/11/2007
Status: offline
|
I read all these posts about the problems of sitting there in traffic jams in hot weather and how this makes the engine to switch into heat protection mode (enrichment or rear cyl shutdown, depending on versions). Well, what I wonder is: why nobody just turns his bike off in traffic jams?
I have to cross daily a traffic light that's very slow. More than a couple of minutes of red light. When I get there and the traffic stops, I just turn off the bike. Save heat, save gas, save trouble...
Same when I'm in a trafficked road and traffic stops for a long time.
Is there something I'm missing?
Maybe people accustomed to old, cick start bikes just doesn't think about turning off his bike during long stops?
_____________________________
====
TEMET
NOSCE
====
It's not the destination that matters, but how you get there.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Sitting there in hot weather traffic... - 5/20/2008 3:07:11 AM
|
|
|
bulldogmoe7
Posts: 2771
Joined: 10/3/2006
From: Clearwater, Florida
Status: offline
|
if i remember what my dad told me it takes more gas to start the car (bike) than it is to leave it running. to me that would be a pain in the ass to shut it off everytime i stopped and started 2 min later.
_____________________________
sig by grubby
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Sitting there in hot weather traffic... - 5/20/2008 3:18:32 AM
|
|
|
travroc
Posts: 240
Joined: 5/13/2008
From: Inland Empire
Status: offline
|
I do the same thing when it is not safe to split.
quote:
ORIGINAL: 99octane
When I get there and the traffic stops, I just turn off the bike. Save heat, save gas, save trouble...
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Sitting there in hot weather traffic... - 5/20/2008 3:24:25 AM
|
|
|
99octane
Posts: 945
Joined: 12/11/2007
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: bulldogmoe7
if i remember what my dad told me it takes more gas to start the car (bike) than it is to leave it running. to me that would be a pain in the ass to shut it off everytime i stopped and started 2 min later.
It was true on old carbureted engines. It's not true anymore on modern EFI engines, for what I know. Now, I'm talking about car engines, I don't know exactly if this is valid for HD engines as well. Surely you don't build up heat, though.
_____________________________
====
TEMET
NOSCE
====
It's not the destination that matters, but how you get there.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Sitting there in hot weather traffic... - 5/20/2008 4:39:57 AM
|
|
|
dog155
Posts: 4625
Joined: 11/5/2006
From: Windham,Maine--God's Country
Status: offline
|
No matter what the cost of fuel do not let an aircooled bike sit and run in those kinds of conditions.You will pay the price if it keeps happening.Years ago it happened to me with a stroked shovel.it sucks!
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Sitting there in hot weather traffic... - 5/20/2008 4:40:14 AM
|
|
|
PWHOG
Posts: 747
Joined: 8/17/2005
From: Hinckley (UK) Wooly Back Country
Status: offline
|
If you switch off the engine on a European version the alarm will self arm itself after approx 30 seconds and the siren will be going off. If you kill the engine with the kill switch to stop the alarm operating you will sit there with the headlamp on draining the battery until you start the motor as our lights are permanently on as well.
_____________________________
The last time the French asked for 'more proof' it came marching into Paris under a German flag
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Sitting there in hot weather traffic... - 5/20/2008 5:16:18 AM
|
|
|
big_al
Posts: 2954
Joined: 10/16/2007
Status: offline
|
People put their bikes away for the winter I put my bike away in the summer wayyyyyy tooooo hottt......
_____________________________
"Life is Full of Opportunities Dont blame others for your Failures"
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Sitting there in hot weather traffic... - 5/20/2008 5:24:11 AM
|
|
|
huffhuff
Posts: 1063
Joined: 9/14/2005
Status: offline
|
taking more fuel to restart than to let idle has never been true. i hate the amount of diesel fuel wasted by trucks idling while the driver is napping or having a meal. but back to the question of shutting the engine off. the engine is still being cooled at idle by the oil splashing the bottoms of the pistons and lubing/cooling the crank and bearings. shut it off and the engine will heat soak and actually rise in temperature.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Sitting there in hot weather traffic... - 5/20/2008 7:27:02 AM
|
|
|
Paniolo
Posts: 569
Joined: 4/30/2005
From: SoCal
Status: offline
|
Actually folks do. Out here in LA I saw a motorcop shut his bike off at a red light.
I was surprised when I first saw it, but then I figured that it made sense.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Sitting there in hot weather traffic... - 5/20/2008 7:47:58 AM
|
|
|
pdks
Posts: 26
Joined: 4/30/2008
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: huffhuff
taking more fuel to restart than to let idle has never been true. i hate the amount of diesel fuel wasted by trucks idling while the driver is napping or having a meal.
but back to the question of shutting the engine off. the engine is still being cooled at idle by the oil splashing the bottoms of the pistons and lubing/cooling the crank and bearings. shut it off and the engine will heat soak and actually rise in temperature.
This makes sense to me. With no oil circulation and no movement forcing air over the fins, the temperature should rise.
An aside: when the gasoline engine is engaged on a modern hybrid car (eg: Toyota Prius), the engine is designed to turn off automatically when the car stops at a light. They then seamlessly 'roar' back into action when the accelerator is depressed.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Sitting there in hot weather traffic... - 5/20/2008 7:55:25 AM
|
|
|
old95
Posts: 504
Joined: 4/10/2007
From: Flowery Branch, Ga.
Status: offline
|
I my be incorrect, if so OK, but turning the engine off I tend to believe gets the motor hotter as an important part of the cooling capability is the engine oil moving. I've done both during trips, but usually just let it run for that reason.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Sitting there in hot weather traffic... - 5/20/2008 8:24:05 AM
|
|
|
BBQ.Uncle
Posts: 93
Joined: 5/6/2008
From: Massachusetts
Status: offline
|
I guess on the one hand it sorta makes sense to shut the engine off due to heat...but, I'd hate to spend those extra few seconds restarting it when I need to get out of a jam or a potential threat now.
_____________________________
BBQ Uncle
KCBS Certified BBQ Judge #29877
2008 FXDF Fat Bob - Crimson Denim
Vance & Hines Shortshots Staggered
Fuelpak
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Sitting there in hot weather traffic... - 5/20/2008 8:30:55 AM
|
|
|
MetalSpike
Posts: 386
Joined: 2/3/2008
From: Peoria, AZ
Status: offline
|
If it's going to be a long red light, I'll turn it off. When It's hotter,n,hell - 110 degrees +, pavement feels like 1000 degress, it gets turned off. I've never had a problem with the bike starting right up.
_____________________________
2008 vivid black Fat Boy
MetalSpike
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Sitting there in hot weather traffic... - 5/20/2008 8:34:53 AM
|
|
|
iceman336
Posts: 276
Joined: 11/21/2007
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: huffhuff
taking more fuel to restart than to let idle has never been true. i hate the amount of diesel fuel wasted by trucks idling while the driver is napping or having a meal. but back to the question of shutting the engine off. the engine is still being cooled at idle by the oil splashing the bottoms of the pistons and lubing/cooling the crank and bearings. shut it off and the engine will heat soak and actually rise in temperature.
Truckers don't have a choice most of the time whether to idle or not. The carriers won't spend the money on a genset with A/C capacity, and living in a metal box attracts heat like nothing else. As a professional driver, I can attest to the fact that the inside of the truck can get 30 - 40 degrees hotter than the temperature outside. Try sleeping in that! Also, many of us have a pet that rides with us and we leave the truck running to allow them to be safe.
_____________________________
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Sitting there in hot weather traffic... - 5/20/2008 8:40:02 AM
|
|
|
TwiggyAZ
Posts: 1358
Joined: 10/16/2007
From: AZ
Status: offline
|
AZ is the hottest dang state in the Nation! And it's getting very hot now! And I live 5,000 ft up! I don't do cities in the summer here. Phoenix has lights that last over 2 minutes. Tucson a little less, but still, if it's 3 in the afternoon, 104 degrees, I don't see the fun in my azz cooking along with the bike. I get up very early, ride till noon, get back to the pool, and chill by the side with a nice summer drink!!
I've never tried shutting the bike off at a light before. But you can bet you azz, someone will honk at me if I'm not moving in .9 seconds...everyone wants to move...now!!!
_____________________________
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Sitting there in hot weather traffic... - 5/20/2008 8:40:12 AM
|
|
|
ConnMan
Posts: 147
Joined: 3/11/2008
From: Venice, FL
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: huffhuff
taking more fuel to restart than to let idle has never been true. i hate the amount of diesel fuel wasted by trucks idling while the driver is napping or having a meal. but back to the question of shutting the engine off. the engine is still being cooled at idle by the oil splashing the bottoms of the pistons and lubing/cooling the crank and bearings. shut it off and the engine will heat soak and actually rise in temperature.
^^^Correct answer.
_____________________________
2008 FXD. Vivid Black.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Sitting there in hot weather traffic... - 5/20/2008 9:36:19 AM
|
|
|
cadman311
Posts: 1226
Joined: 2/8/2007
From: DUNDALK,MARYLAND
Status: offline
|
Use an engine fan or parade fan it helps cool your bike at slow traffic. Motorcop have use them for years.
_____________________________
07 FXDL LOWRIDER Pearl Red
Stock punch out pipes, SERT
RK-3910 K&N 2 1/4" Tall Filter
04 ROAD GLIDE
SMOKEY GOLD
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Sitting there in hot weather traffic... - 5/20/2008 9:40:20 AM
|
|
|
Merlin
Posts: 387
Joined: 1/23/2006
Status: offline
|
I had that overheating problem.
I put in a HD Super Premium Oil cooler and Mobil1 V-Twin in the engine.
No more problem.
NOTE: Don't turn your bike off at a light. Besides not helping with the heat it's not safe!
Pull off the road let the bike cool down for ten to fifteen minutes.
_____________________________
03 Silver/Black Road Glide
SERT, SE 203 & SE 95" Flats
.030 Cometic gasket, Lyndall Brakes
CHUBBY® Wild1 WO517 BARS
V&H True Duals with SE II Slip Ons
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Sitting there in hot weather traffic... - 5/20/2008 1:20:44 PM
|
|
|
oldairboater
Posts: 430
Joined: 1/2/2008
From: Republic of Texas
Status: offline
|
Sitting here reading all of this. I have been caught by traffic at a rally and had to just shut off the bike and wait. I have never been caught at a red light that kept me long enough to be a concern. The few times I have been caught on freeway----I have bailed off or split traffic till I could bail off. Got caught one time with everything screwed up traffic wise [wreck and construction] --I should have seen that one coming but had head up butt that day---bailed to service station on feeder road---parked near grass in shade and locked bike---took nap with head on helmet till traffic cleared. Was hard to cat nap with all the horn honking and cussing but I managed.
_____________________________
JB
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Sitting there in hot weather traffic... - 5/20/2008 2:04:43 PM
|
|
|
FastHoss
Posts: 333
Joined: 12/28/2007
Status: offline
|
I talked to a bike cop last time I was at a bike deal there in Vegas,it was hot as hell,he told me they run regular oil in their bikes and have never lost an engine due to overheating,dino oil,no coolers or fans.It was so hot my oil temp was 300 degrees and my neutral light stopped working,after that trip I run syn.and a oil cooler.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Sitting there in hot weather traffic... - 5/20/2008 5:45:31 PM
|
|
|
Other Sheep
Posts: 588
Joined: 2/14/2008
Status: offline
|
I'll do it if I know the light is going to be a long wait. A few in Escondido take two minutes or more. But I'll watch the cross lights so when it changes I'll be up and running. I'm wondering if the XiED will allow me to let it idle more without shutting down.
_____________________________
Wherever we end up I guess. But we will start in Escondido, CA
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Sitting there in hot weather traffic... - 5/21/2008 5:30:58 AM
|
|
|
Dennydp
Multiple Time Contributor
Posts: 3848
Joined: 10/10/2007
Status: offline
|
An oil cooler does help keep the engine cooler when moving but when your at a stop with no airflow its hot
_____________________________
Happy owner 07 Ultra
V&H trueduals-Rhineheart slip ons-Techlusion-Doherty air cleaner-IDS-Hogtunes-TWR Stabilizer and more
and
97RK around town scoot
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Sitting there in hot weather traffic... - 5/21/2008 6:08:21 AM
|
|
|
cadman311
Posts: 1226
Joined: 2/8/2007
From: DUNDALK,MARYLAND
Status: offline
|
The fans do helps in the stop and go traffic. I do alot of baltimore to D.C. ride for work. It can turn into a stop and go traffic in no time. Then start moving at 85+ mph.
I like to tell Fasthoss that the motorcops don't do that many miles on there bikes and they resale them every other year. They are great low milage bikes. Most police motorcop are leasing there bikes.
_____________________________
07 FXDL LOWRIDER Pearl Red
Stock punch out pipes, SERT
RK-3910 K&N 2 1/4" Tall Filter
04 ROAD GLIDE
SMOKEY GOLD
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Sitting there in hot weather traffic... - 5/21/2008 7:53:47 AM
|
|
|
99octane
Posts: 945
Joined: 12/11/2007
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: PWHOG
If you switch off the engine on a European version the alarm will self arm itself after approx 30 seconds and the siren will be going off. If you kill the engine with the kill switch to stop the alarm operating you will sit there with the headlamp on draining the battery until you start the motor as our lights are permanently on as well.
If you kill the engine for a minute or so with the light on, nothing particularly nasty happens :)
If I have to sit there longer, I switch off everything.
The alarm on mine sets in in about 5-10 seconds after switching off the main.
And it won't go off if you sit on it with the FOB in your pocket. ;)
Don't know about the older models, though. Mine is a '07 FXDC
_____________________________
====
TEMET
NOSCE
====
It's not the destination that matters, but how you get there.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Sitting there in hot weather traffic... - 5/21/2008 8:01:43 AM
|
|
|
99octane
Posts: 945
Joined: 12/11/2007
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: huffhuff
taking more fuel to restart than to let idle has never been true. i hate the amount of diesel fuel wasted by trucks idling while the driver is napping or having a meal. but back to the question of shutting the engine off. the engine is still being cooled at idle by the oil splashing the bottoms of the pistons and lubing/cooling the crank and bearings. shut it off and the engine will heat soak and actually rise in temperature.
Heat doesn't generate out of nothing. It is generated by combustion and passes from hotter parts to colder parts. So, if you stop the engine, the heat in the engine will redistribute: some colder parts will get hotter, but other hotter parts will get cool, which is what you want, since the colder parts would in the hend get hotter anyway on an air cooled engine, and the hot parts would get WAY too hot.
Mind me: owning a turbocharged car with a high performance engine (about 180 hp/liter specific power which is higher than many race cars) I know very well the dangers of killing an engine without letting the cooling plant cool down the hottest parts. If you don't do that, oil flux will cease in the red-hot turbocharger turbine and will cook damaging the shaft in the next run. But that's true on a liquid cooled engine.
On an air cooled engine, when you stop temperature can only rise, and it does. The longer you wait, the hotter it will get. The sooner you switch it off, the better.
The oil sprayed on the bottom of the piston is good to cool down piston ceiling, but will work only with a running bike where the air flux cools the engine, the sump and the oil in it. By letting the engine run long while stationary you damage the properties of the oil itself by letting it get too hot.
Perhaps things change with an oil cooler, but without one?
PS: 300 °F is WAY too hot for any oil. Motor oil will start degrading around 250 °F, for what I know.
< Message edited by 99octane -- 5/21/2008 8:14:42 AM >
_____________________________
====
TEMET
NOSCE
====
It's not the destination that matters, but how you get there.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Sitting there in hot weather traffic... - 5/21/2008 11:38:53 AM
|
|
|
mark10
Posts: 268
Joined: 6/5/2007
Status: offline
|
my understanding is that there is some limit on the length of a stop light, but it does differ depending on where you are at. here in chicago it is 3 minutes, soon, i believe to be extended, but in part to allow time for pedestrians to cross the street.
i don't usually shut down at stop lights as you have to reset it to start it back up.
however - if it appears that it will be a longer stop for whatever reason - freight train is a good one in our area - then i will shut it off
and although i have never done a scientific study - i can tell that letting it run is a lot hotter than shutting it off - without a doubt. when said in this thread that it gets hotter shutting it off (and the insinuation that shutting it off is bad) than leaving it run, then what happens every time i bring it home and park it.
as to additional gas usage - i think the issue was that the electric power needed to start had to be replaced so the alternator (generator back in the day) had to run more which took more power when charging the battery and thus took more gas to supply that power - wasn't that starting itself actually took more gas - but then again, what do i know
should i be stuck in traffic - i just reroute as soon as possible
and should there ever be a reason for a gps it is so you can get that traffic/construction notification that is available - you will know about traffic problems miles before you encounter it.
|
|
|
|
 Today's Posts
Most Active Topics
Make A Donation
Forum Rules & FAQ
RSS Feeds
| |
Printable Version
