Engine Mechanical Topics Discussion for motor builds, cams, head work, stripped bolts and other engine related issues. The good and the bad. If it goes round and around or up and down, post it here.

All's good til 4,000 rpm...

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
  #1  
Old 08-06-2016, 11:42 AM
PeterV's Avatar
PeterV
PeterV is offline
Tourer
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 330
Received 168 Likes on 59 Posts
Default All's good til 4,000 rpm...

First up, the hardware:
2002 FLHT
88" bored to 95" on stock cylinders
Stock heads decked .020, .015 cometic head gasket set. Head volume @ 76cc
In & Ex ports cleaned up from casting defects.
Dual springs (not beehives).
SE cast flattops
SE forged rocker supports, with stock rocker arms
Andrews TW26G cams
SE cam support plate
SE tapered pushrods
-99B lifters
Mikuni 42 (SE air cleaner system)
V&H Pro Pipe
SE Ignition (10 degree retard on WOT) and DTT ignition as backup.

Symptoms:
Re&re took place at 100,000 miles.
Fast forward to now (150,000 miles)
Slight to moderate knocking on startup, tried to trace it, come up empty.
As motor warms up, knocking goes away, at operating temperature nothing there
Usual mechanical top end noises at moderate engine loads. I used foam ear plugs to cut out other noises and still can hear what's goin on inside the rocker covers, the top end sounds happy, no clanging, banging...everything's doing their job.
....until 4000rpm and higher, under load or steady throttle
It sounds as
a) rocker hitting the cover at random, not repetitive
and..
b) Inner and outer springs contacting each other, not repetitive
and..
c) on decel, loss of clearance from lifter to pushrod to rocker arm, as it knocks for a second, then all good as decel continues down the rpms. Oil pressure's checked out @34psi steady throttle, 36psi under full load over 3,000rps and above
There is no power loss during all this. Power comes in really well at 2200rpm, all the way to 5000rpm. Motor dynoes at 99ft-lbs torque, 86hp.
(A/f was dead on except 2700-3600 dip to 12:1. Dropped needle one notch afterwards, before a long roadtrip, btw bike ran great...but with the symptoms above).
So..before I go in and see, any guesses, tips or advise, or past similar experience would be helpful.
Long post, sorry
 
  #2  
Old 08-06-2016, 12:02 PM
ROCKOUT Rocker Products's Avatar
ROCKOUT Rocker Products
ROCKOUT Rocker Products is offline
Sponsor
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: SF Bay area
Posts: 8,529
Received 1,628 Likes on 1,176 Posts
Default

Any chance it's rocker shaft noise? Usually happens at a lower RPM but....?

__________________________________________________ ____
For ROCKOUT information & purchasing please click the LINKS below...
 
__________________
NO, they DON'T all do that!
ROCKOUT rocker shaft inserts... make the tapping STOP! From the guy that FOUND and CURED the problem NO ONE ELSE COULD, thank you for your support!
Ordering & info http://www.rockout.biz On ebay! ... CLICK HERE
Also on amazon.com...
Imitated, never equaled... ROCKOUTS!


  #3  
Old 08-06-2016, 12:06 PM
PeterV's Avatar
PeterV
PeterV is offline
Tourer
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 330
Received 168 Likes on 59 Posts
Default

No, I know the common noise you're referring to. I'd classify this motor as a "quiet" one when it comes to rocker shafts
 
  #4  
Old 08-06-2016, 03:11 PM
Max Headflow's Avatar
Max Headflow
Max Headflow is offline
Seasoned HDF Member
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: poway
Posts: 16,099
Received 5,252 Likes on 3,626 Posts
Default

Ride it..

Try some seafoam through the intake and change the lifters if it bothers you.. You can also play with lifter preload.
 
  #5  
Old 08-06-2016, 09:15 PM
PeterV's Avatar
PeterV
PeterV is offline
Tourer
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 330
Received 168 Likes on 59 Posts
Default

And that's exactly what I did...sprayed a can of the stuff in the carb throat, lotsa crap outta the tailpipe, all noises are gone.
I changed lifters last week, put in some Feuling HPs.
Carbon related?...hmmm
 
  #6  
Old 08-08-2016, 05:21 AM
Hillsidecycle.com's Avatar
Hillsidecycle.com
Hillsidecycle.com is offline
Sponsor
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 12,085
Received 816 Likes on 581 Posts
Default

I'd suggest loading the lifter to .140" for starters.
Scott
 
__________________
HILLSIDE MOTORCYCLE & MACHINE, INC.
HARLEY-DAVIDSON SPEED & SERVICE CENTER
5225 SOUTH MAIN ST., MUNNSVILLE, N.Y. 13409
Sales/Support 315-495-6650
www.hillsidecycle.com
Walk-in Retail Showroom
Complete H-D Machine Shop
Case & cylinder boring
Complete Cylinder Head Shop
High-Performance Engine Kits
Crank Rebuilding
Direct Link & PowerVision Tuning
Goodson HD Tooling Manufacturer
Maxton Mile World Record
4500 sq ft. facility

OVER 35 YEARS OF H-D ENGINE BUILDING.
See us on Facebook.
  #7  
Old 08-08-2016, 07:01 PM
PeterV's Avatar
PeterV
PeterV is offline
Tourer
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 330
Received 168 Likes on 59 Posts
Default

Feuling recommends .090-.100" with adjustable pushrods.
I adjusted exactly 2.5 turns on the SEs
(the tapered SE pushrods are 24tpi, 2.39 turns give out a .100" measurment. I've always turned 2.5 turns, what SE recommends with stock 99b lifters.
The picture is of the piston of one of the 99b lifters I replaced. It shows some marking, but insignificant from my point of view.
What it does show, I think, is the loading as the lifter goes to work.
Am I on the right track thinking there's more room to load, as Scott suggests to go up to .140" or am I reading the wear marks backwards?
(understanding of course I'm now using Feuling lifters and how they relate to adjustments)
Thanks for all the help


 
  #8  
Old 08-08-2016, 09:50 PM
Blowby's Avatar
Blowby
Blowby is offline
Road Captain
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: USA
Posts: 525
Received 167 Likes on 70 Posts
Default

Had some lifter issues a while back and now using Wood's newer Alpha lifters. I started at .133 (4 turns, 1 flat) and was hearing tapping as oil reached operating temp. Added more preload to .143 (4 turns, 3 flats) and rode it for another 1,000 miles. Still not at a reasonable noise level for me so bumped the preload to .154 (4 turns, 5 flats) and all is good the last 500 miles of riding.

BTW: I do have the Rockout kit installed about 5,000 miles ago which was a noticeable difference.
 
Related Topics
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
ThisIsMe
Touring Models
6
09-22-2014 10:49 PM
hogginit
Exhaust System Topics
11
10-08-2012 11:45 PM
al baehr
Touring Models
7
07-06-2011 10:18 AM
SecondChance!!
Touring Models
12
04-20-2011 06:01 PM
Varooom
Touring Models
18
03-03-2010 08:48 AM



Quick Reply: All's good til 4,000 rpm...



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:24 AM.