Rough running after engine upgrades.
Rough running after engine upgrades.
Hello,
I kindly ask for your help guys. I have a friend who is very passionate about Harley Davidson motorcycles. As we live in Romania, we do not have here very good HD dealers. My friend bike is realy impressive, a tons of mods, many done by himself. The problem is that after some engine upgrades\mods, bike is not running well and we do not know what to do.
Bike is : HD Heritage Softail Classic, Twin Cam 88, 2001, 15.000 miles. Bike were running well before the engine mods.
Mods :
Cam Plate Feuling 8011,
Oil Pump Feuling 7060,
Lifters Feuling 4000 HP+,
Push Rod Fuel Moto with 32 threads/inch,
Camshaft TW 21 Andrews heavy biker.
Two issues, after the above parts were installed :
1. Initial, after the zero lash, the preload on the new PRs was set to 20 flats => not running well, no power. Then preload was set to 24 flats => bike runs perfect, but for just one mile, after that rough running, no power.
Bike idles well and no backfiring through exhaust or carb.
2. Into the oil tank we can see bubbles of air when engine running => dont know if this is a problem or not ?? They were not there, with the original oil pump.
Thanks in advance
Marcel
I kindly ask for your help guys. I have a friend who is very passionate about Harley Davidson motorcycles. As we live in Romania, we do not have here very good HD dealers. My friend bike is realy impressive, a tons of mods, many done by himself. The problem is that after some engine upgrades\mods, bike is not running well and we do not know what to do.
Bike is : HD Heritage Softail Classic, Twin Cam 88, 2001, 15.000 miles. Bike were running well before the engine mods.
Mods :
Cam Plate Feuling 8011,
Oil Pump Feuling 7060,
Lifters Feuling 4000 HP+,
Push Rod Fuel Moto with 32 threads/inch,
Camshaft TW 21 Andrews heavy biker.
Two issues, after the above parts were installed :
1. Initial, after the zero lash, the preload on the new PRs was set to 20 flats => not running well, no power. Then preload was set to 24 flats => bike runs perfect, but for just one mile, after that rough running, no power.
Bike idles well and no backfiring through exhaust or carb.
2. Into the oil tank we can see bubbles of air when engine running => dont know if this is a problem or not ?? They were not there, with the original oil pump.
Thanks in advance
Marcel
The bike has VH exhausts w/ baffles, hypercharger and Twin-Tek fuel controller. We did no adjustments after the installation of the new parts. The instructions for the new parts, didn't require EFI tuning of the bike.
Thanks
Marcel
Thanks
Marcel
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 5,074
Likes: 1,007
when dealing with chain drive, sometimes it is easy to miss a mark.
chances are the new oil pump has a higher volume scavenge section and therefore it will send oil back to the bag with spurts and aeration.
when she shuts down, any extra top end noise? if the hydraulic lifters do not get a solid oil flow and without aeration, they will not operate the valves correctly and issues will arise. i assume you have collapsible p/r tubes, when it shuts down, turn off the engine and check them to see if the are sloppy or pumped up. another point is lifters come with a variety of bleed rates that must match up to engine design, if they bleed to fast, will not operate correctly, adding the extra preload could be the clue. also, might be just one bad (even new) lifter.
chances are the new oil pump has a higher volume scavenge section and therefore it will send oil back to the bag with spurts and aeration.
when she shuts down, any extra top end noise? if the hydraulic lifters do not get a solid oil flow and without aeration, they will not operate the valves correctly and issues will arise. i assume you have collapsible p/r tubes, when it shuts down, turn off the engine and check them to see if the are sloppy or pumped up. another point is lifters come with a variety of bleed rates that must match up to engine design, if they bleed to fast, will not operate correctly, adding the extra preload could be the clue. also, might be just one bad (even new) lifter.
Last edited by bustert; Apr 27, 2018 at 08:35 AM.
Road Captain
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 648
Likes: 35
From: San Diego
I still think you need a new tune with the Andrews 21. Thats being said, if you are off a tooth on the timing, then do a compression test. You should see roughly 30psi difference between the cylinders.
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Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 19,960
Likes: 8,054
From: poway
While Marcel says carb the first post, he also says.
Which indicates that it is EFI. Bike will need a tune / adjustment. I don't know if controller selected is the issue but I've known a few that have had issues with then on bigger builds.
I would check compression. Pushrods adjusted at 20 to 24 turns should not make any difference in how the bike runs. There is likely something else wrong. I would check compression.. Cam timing could be off as mentioned. Still, it's EFI and will likely need tuning even tho the instructions don't say anything about it.
Bubbles in the oil tank is normal but there are likely more due to the bigger oil pump.
The bike has VH exhausts w/ baffles, hypercharger and Twin-Tek fuel controller. We did no adjustments after the installation of the new parts. The instructions for the new parts, didn't require EFI tuning of the bike.
I would check compression. Pushrods adjusted at 20 to 24 turns should not make any difference in how the bike runs. There is likely something else wrong. I would check compression.. Cam timing could be off as mentioned. Still, it's EFI and will likely need tuning even tho the instructions don't say anything about it.
Bubbles in the oil tank is normal but there are likely more due to the bigger oil pump.
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Grand HDF Member
Joined: May 2014
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From: florida
you will need to tune either way, injected or carbed,,,one is one way one the other.
do your comp check and try to make sure your cam timing is correct, as no amount of tuning will fix anything if you have issues in those areas. report back and let us know what you find.
m
do your comp check and try to make sure your cam timing is correct, as no amount of tuning will fix anything if you have issues in those areas. report back and let us know what you find.
m
Many thanks for the answers.
The bike is EFI, not carb, my mistake, sorry.
No extra top end noise when shut down.. The engine is realy quiet, nice sound. Only issue is no power...
Oil pump, lifters & cam plate were kit from Feuling, for this bike type. I assume they should work well together ...
Feuling said they are not worried about the bubbles. Also they recomend .90 - .100 (20 flats) preload. We had this preload and bike had realy no power. Then we increased preload to .125 (24 flats) => realy good power, but after 1 mile no power again ...
The bike is EFI, not carb, my mistake, sorry.
No extra top end noise when shut down.. The engine is realy quiet, nice sound. Only issue is no power...
Oil pump, lifters & cam plate were kit from Feuling, for this bike type. I assume they should work well together ...
Feuling said they are not worried about the bubbles. Also they recomend .90 - .100 (20 flats) preload. We had this preload and bike had realy no power. Then we increased preload to .125 (24 flats) => realy good power, but after 1 mile no power again ...