W6 cam 10:1 compression questions
#1
W6 cam 10:1 compression questions
First off I'll say Hi as this is my first post. I've used this forum for years for research and help by reading more than I'll remember. My background is as a Diesel mechanic, working on Semis, Dumptrucks, Tractors and the likes. So yes I have knowledge and tools but not an expert on Harley's. Been riding for years and have rebuilt my bikes many times but never got into heavy modification and that is what leads me to finally post.
The bike is a 97 Heritage (slimmed down), rebuilt heads, .020" bore, SE42 mik carb, SE ignition, 2-1 pipe, hypercharger intake, EV27 cam. I love the bike, it has served me well but I ride aggressive, and ready to up it in power to fit my riding style.
I have spent hours reading posts, comments, and opinions but alas, I need your help.
Looking to get heads ported and milled (currently stock), Woods W6 cam, get CR to 10:1, another .010" hone in the cylinders.
Now what is the best way to achieve the 10:1 CR for this motor? I'm trying to stay as close to flattop pistons as possible, I don't want to just throw in huge dome pistons, but I can also only mill the heads to the extreme of .060" (which I'd rather not do that much), with cometic thin gasket gets me somewhere around 9.5:1-9.8:1.
So do I mill .030"-.040" and thin gasket with a small pop up pistons? My head is filled with measurements, valve lifts, cam specs etc and I just need an outside opinion at this point.
Been in talks with Hillside Cycles a little and also have Short Block Charlie only 1 hour away from me. Just a matter of pulling the trigger on the right setup.
HELP?!
The bike is a 97 Heritage (slimmed down), rebuilt heads, .020" bore, SE42 mik carb, SE ignition, 2-1 pipe, hypercharger intake, EV27 cam. I love the bike, it has served me well but I ride aggressive, and ready to up it in power to fit my riding style.
I have spent hours reading posts, comments, and opinions but alas, I need your help.
Looking to get heads ported and milled (currently stock), Woods W6 cam, get CR to 10:1, another .010" hone in the cylinders.
Now what is the best way to achieve the 10:1 CR for this motor? I'm trying to stay as close to flattop pistons as possible, I don't want to just throw in huge dome pistons, but I can also only mill the heads to the extreme of .060" (which I'd rather not do that much), with cometic thin gasket gets me somewhere around 9.5:1-9.8:1.
So do I mill .030"-.040" and thin gasket with a small pop up pistons? My head is filled with measurements, valve lifts, cam specs etc and I just need an outside opinion at this point.
Been in talks with Hillside Cycles a little and also have Short Block Charlie only 1 hour away from me. Just a matter of pulling the trigger on the right setup.
HELP?!
#2
First off I'll say Hi as this is my first post. I've used this forum for years for research and help by reading more than I'll remember. My background is as a Diesel mechanic, working on Semis, Dumptrucks, Tractors and the likes. So yes I have knowledge and tools but not an expert on Harley's. Been riding for years and have rebuilt my bikes many times but never got into heavy modification and that is what leads me to finally post.
The bike is a 97 Heritage (slimmed down), rebuilt heads, .020" bore, SE42 mik carb, SE ignition, 2-1 pipe, hypercharger intake, EV27 cam. I love the bike, it has served me well but I ride aggressive, and ready to up it in power to fit my riding style.
I have spent hours reading posts, comments, and opinions but alas, I need your help.
Looking to get heads ported and milled (currently stock), Woods W6 cam, get CR to 10:1, another .010" hone in the cylinders.
Now what is the best way to achieve the 10:1 CR for this motor? I'm trying to stay as close to flattop pistons as possible, I don't want to just throw in huge dome pistons, but I can also only mill the heads to the extreme of .060" (which I'd rather not do that much), with cometic thin gasket gets me somewhere around 9.5:1-9.8:1.
So do I mill .030"-.040" and thin gasket with a small pop up pistons? My head is filled with measurements, valve lifts, cam specs etc and I just need an outside opinion at this point.
Been in talks with Hillside Cycles a little and also have Short Block Charlie only 1 hour away from me. Just a matter of pulling the trigger on the right setup.
HELP?!
The bike is a 97 Heritage (slimmed down), rebuilt heads, .020" bore, SE42 mik carb, SE ignition, 2-1 pipe, hypercharger intake, EV27 cam. I love the bike, it has served me well but I ride aggressive, and ready to up it in power to fit my riding style.
I have spent hours reading posts, comments, and opinions but alas, I need your help.
Looking to get heads ported and milled (currently stock), Woods W6 cam, get CR to 10:1, another .010" hone in the cylinders.
Now what is the best way to achieve the 10:1 CR for this motor? I'm trying to stay as close to flattop pistons as possible, I don't want to just throw in huge dome pistons, but I can also only mill the heads to the extreme of .060" (which I'd rather not do that much), with cometic thin gasket gets me somewhere around 9.5:1-9.8:1.
So do I mill .030"-.040" and thin gasket with a small pop up pistons? My head is filled with measurements, valve lifts, cam specs etc and I just need an outside opinion at this point.
Been in talks with Hillside Cycles a little and also have Short Block Charlie only 1 hour away from me. Just a matter of pulling the trigger on the right setup.
HELP?!
#3
Hillside will not steer you wrong.
Like you have done and most people don't do this is OUT LINE your end goal.
There are two directions you can go on this or meld them all together.
Big bore will give pwr, across the board.
It is the most EZ way to go.
It also allows for upgrades latter usually.
High CR ratio with the appropriate changes makes for a perky right now, blast of a bike .- but other stuff is needed to extract the pwr,- cams, ports, larger valves, exhaust, ignition, etc etc etc)
Done right will blow past a bigger engine with lower CR. That is engines that only did the big bore. ( no Cams, ports, exhaust, etc etc)
Or you can do both.
It is my opinion - HD Oficial "stage kits suck" cause they just do what should have been done coming dwn the assembly line.
Next-
I am not sure what you have against angled pistons as they bring power to the table.
Remember,- pwr starts with an area of pie, or bore and we go from there.
The angle top or high dome provides "more area" for the push beside the other attributes. It cheats the pie formula.
In the end of this circle, you need a physcotirest to help YOU with your end goal -Scott is a good man for the job.
(PS 0.20 pistons just clean up the bore not much else.)
Throw the hyper charger at someone as it says a lot about aptitude, ...not anything good either.
It is a slippery slope !
I did not mention larger wheels as I am an "Over SQuare " man.
You and I are confined by inner dialogs of right and wrong and I have Porsche in my blood.
Real engines develop way past the one to one ratio of "one HP per cube."
Yet, there are people on here that will argue 1.35 is too much.........which is just so silly.
I would make 1.35 a minimum goal
Like you have done and most people don't do this is OUT LINE your end goal.
There are two directions you can go on this or meld them all together.
Big bore will give pwr, across the board.
It is the most EZ way to go.
It also allows for upgrades latter usually.
High CR ratio with the appropriate changes makes for a perky right now, blast of a bike .- but other stuff is needed to extract the pwr,- cams, ports, larger valves, exhaust, ignition, etc etc etc)
Done right will blow past a bigger engine with lower CR. That is engines that only did the big bore. ( no Cams, ports, exhaust, etc etc)
Or you can do both.
It is my opinion - HD Oficial "stage kits suck" cause they just do what should have been done coming dwn the assembly line.
Next-
I am not sure what you have against angled pistons as they bring power to the table.
Remember,- pwr starts with an area of pie, or bore and we go from there.
The angle top or high dome provides "more area" for the push beside the other attributes. It cheats the pie formula.
In the end of this circle, you need a physcotirest to help YOU with your end goal -Scott is a good man for the job.
(PS 0.20 pistons just clean up the bore not much else.)
Throw the hyper charger at someone as it says a lot about aptitude, ...not anything good either.
It is a slippery slope !
I did not mention larger wheels as I am an "Over SQuare " man.
You and I are confined by inner dialogs of right and wrong and I have Porsche in my blood.
Real engines develop way past the one to one ratio of "one HP per cube."
Yet, there are people on here that will argue 1.35 is too much.........which is just so silly.
I would make 1.35 a minimum goal
#4
#5
So it sounds like I'm on the right track then. Doesn't solve my question of how to best achieve 10.0:1 CR though. Everyone has their own opinion on Flattop vs Dome pistons. Personally with a tight quench and flattop piston, more efficient of a combustion and even flame across the piston face which I personally believe does help a little bit at lower end torque. That's the dillema I have I guess. Also dome pistons just more reciprocating weight I would think
#6
To establish 10.0 compression in an Evo, a piston would be the way.
A Wood 6 at 10.0, is a great combination.
Scott
A Wood 6 at 10.0, is a great combination.
Scott
__________________
HILLSIDE MOTORCYCLE & MACHINE, INC.
HARLEY-DAVIDSON SPEED & SERVICE CENTER
5225 SOUTH MAIN ST., MUNNSVILLE, N.Y. 13409
Sales/Support 315-495-6650
www.hillsidecycle.com
Walk-in Retail Showroom
Complete H-D Machine Shop
Case & cylinder boring
Complete Cylinder Head Shop
High-Performance Engine Kits
Crank Rebuilding
Direct Link & PowerVision Tuning
Goodson HD Tooling Manufacturer
Maxton Mile World Record
4500 sq ft. facility
OVER 35 YEARS OF H-D ENGINE BUILDING.
See us on Facebook.
HILLSIDE MOTORCYCLE & MACHINE, INC.
HARLEY-DAVIDSON SPEED & SERVICE CENTER
5225 SOUTH MAIN ST., MUNNSVILLE, N.Y. 13409
Sales/Support 315-495-6650
www.hillsidecycle.com
Walk-in Retail Showroom
Complete H-D Machine Shop
Case & cylinder boring
Complete Cylinder Head Shop
High-Performance Engine Kits
Crank Rebuilding
Direct Link & PowerVision Tuning
Goodson HD Tooling Manufacturer
Maxton Mile World Record
4500 sq ft. facility
OVER 35 YEARS OF H-D ENGINE BUILDING.
See us on Facebook.
#7
Thanks for everyone's input. Scott it seems that I will indeed follow your expertise. So would it be better to just throw in some Wiseco 10.0:1 pistons or go with 9.5:1 Pistons and shave the rest off the head to achieve the 10:1? Or am I just splitting hairs at this point? I was always taught that it's better to shave head to raise compression keeping in mind pushrod length and rocker arm angle of course.
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#8
#9
This is pretty much the motor in my Evo,
The heads are Hillsides, it runs amazing, makes great power and TQ. I have the .20 over Wiseco's, with the just a couple exceptions or substitutions, I am running a Super E, and D&D Fatcat with the Woods Baffles.
I would just follow what Scott suggests and get the CR from the correct Wiseco's. In fact I would probably just sent the cylinders and Heads and they could ring the piston right to the bore.
The heads are Hillsides, it runs amazing, makes great power and TQ. I have the .20 over Wiseco's, with the just a couple exceptions or substitutions, I am running a Super E, and D&D Fatcat with the Woods Baffles.
I would just follow what Scott suggests and get the CR from the correct Wiseco's. In fact I would probably just sent the cylinders and Heads and they could ring the piston right to the bore.
#10
Thanks Scott and PaintSlinger. Scott I'll be in contact with you via email shortly. Going to also contact SBC since he's here in the valley, but will probably just have Hillside do all the work.