EVO All Evo Model Discussion

Fuel cap lid, Vapor Lock, and VOES

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  #11  
Old 09-14-2018, 01:41 PM
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I know I need a new fuel cap, just don’t know much about what makes a VOES work. Hell, until a week ago mine wasn’t even connected lol
 
  #12  
Old 09-14-2018, 01:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Uncle G.
My Softail also has a vent line running from the gas tank to a check valve located on the swingarm. On California bikes that’s where the charcoal cannister was located. Mine just terminates in a check valve.

I’m not sure yours has this but it’s something else to look for.
I’ll look for that, thanks!
 
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Old 09-14-2018, 02:45 PM
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Hook up Daytona TT and will tell ya for ya plus get rid of all the crap in-between.
The VOS is nothing more than a timing retard switch
 
  #14  
Old 09-16-2018, 03:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Cowboy812
Ok guys, so here’s my issue of the week.

those who have followed my threads know I’m kinda new to working on motorcycles. But I have it running pretty damn good now. Issue is that intermittently I will get sputtering and lack of power at WOT.


Yes skip the VOES part. First thought I had was the float level in carb might be a bit low.

Anyone been in the carb recently?

WP
 

Last edited by WP50; 09-16-2018 at 03:32 PM.
  #15  
Old 09-17-2018, 04:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Yankee Dog
I know my dyna has a vent in the tank and it is semi-hidden. It's a small metal nipple/bung coming off the filler neck with tubing running under the tank dash to frame, then along frame to rear of bike.
The tank isn't vented through the cap...on a touring bike it is vented though a hose hooked to this:

A vented cap on a touring bike would be dangerous...because of the compartment around the gas cap...

It would fill with fumes and be quite explosive.


 

Last edited by Tom84FXST; 09-17-2018 at 07:20 PM.
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  #16  
Old 09-18-2018, 05:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Cowboy812
Short version:
Bike runs like **** randomly after getting hot, it is vapor locking, and the fuel cap is non vented. If I change to a vented style do I need alter the VOES?

What bike? Are you sure your cap is supposed to be vented? Do you have an in line gas filter?
 

Last edited by Hey Man; 09-18-2018 at 05:33 PM.
  #17  
Old 09-19-2018, 08:45 AM
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Originally Posted by Kingglide549
Hook up Daytona TT and will tell ya for ya plus get rid of all the crap in-between.
The VOS is nothing more than a timing retard switch
The VOES is actually an advance unit. The normal open switch in the VOES allows the timing curve to run up normally through the initial curve. When the switch makes (under light load, hi vacuum) it advances the timing to full advance or 35*. It's all about meeting EPA regulations. On a stock motor it works pretty good but when you start messing with compression it can cause detonation...
 

Last edited by 98hotrodfatboy; 09-19-2018 at 08:47 AM.
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  #18  
Old 09-19-2018, 09:14 AM
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Originally Posted by 98hotrodfatboy
The VOES is actually an advance unit. The normal open switch in the VOES allows the timing curve to run up normally through the initial curve. When the switch makes (under light load, hi vacuum) it advances the timing to full advance or 35*. It's all about meeting EPA regulations. On a stock motor it works pretty good but when you start messing with compression it can cause detonation...
So this isn't a 'Good Thing©®™'? It's surely good for mpg's and really isn't leaning out the bike if one knows how to adjust the carb...correct?

Or are you saying that removing the VOES really won't make any difference in the power band, mpg's or how it runs? I'm not trying to sound like a smartass, I'm actually very curious to know. If I can get the same mpg's, no difference in the power band, and run just exactly the same as 'with' the thing, I'd love to remove it, as it's just one more expensive piece of something I wouldn't need and couldn't easily afford on a fixed income.
 
  #19  
Old 09-19-2018, 11:53 AM
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Originally Posted by tar_snake
So this isn't a 'Good Thing©®™'? It's surely good for mpg's and really isn't leaning out the bike if one knows how to adjust the carb...correct?

Or are you saying that removing the VOES really won't make any difference in the power band, mpg's or how it runs? I'm not trying to sound like a smartass, I'm actually very curious to know. If I can get the same mpg's, no difference in the power band, and run just exactly the same as 'with' the thing, I'd love to remove it, as it's just one more expensive piece of something I wouldn't need and couldn't easily afford on a fixed income.
No I'm not considering you a smart ***. I always ask if I don't understand... In school most kids in my class hated me cause I always had my hand up... Anyways you have a very logical question, so...

Yes on the first part.. if you get your carb dialed in properly. But you need to remember that timing does make a difference in AFR's . I believe that 1* of timing can make a .2 difference in AFR treading. Bagger and I covered this in a thread a while back.. I might be off with my ratio cause my memory isn't the greatest..

Example: a stock timing curve is running 25* advance at 2800 RPM so if you tipping in the throttle at that 2800 RPM the voes will ground advancing the timing 10* . So if your running say 13.8 AFR at 2800 and then the voes grounds advancing to 35* that 10* of timing advance will actually raise your AFR 2 full points 15.8 and yes that would cause detonation on a high compression motor... That's why I don't bother to use it... How much better mileage are you really going to get. 1-3 mpg? Maybe... Can't really confirm that but you can try a tank of fuel with the voes and a tank of fuel without the voes to confirm for your style of riding..

Part 2: no it's not going to make a difference in power because as soon as you throttle up and vacuum decreases it will break the ground to the voes and revert to the normal timing curve.. remember this as well. The more advance you run the hotter the motor will run. And just so you know I don't believe for tip in cruising you will get the same mileage.. it will drop. How much depends on the way you ride..

Like I said earlier I don't recommend a voes on a built hi compression motor.. Back in the day I was running Accell distributors on my SBC because the stock distributor that had vacuum advance, that was identical to the voes was not good for detonation even then with 98 octane fuel..
 

Last edited by 98hotrodfatboy; 09-19-2018 at 11:55 AM.
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  #20  
Old 09-20-2018, 01:57 PM
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Originally Posted by 98hotrodfatboy
No I'm not considering you a smart ***. I always ask if I don't understand... In school most kids in my class hated me cause I always had my hand up... Anyways you have a very logical question, so...

Yes on the first part.. if you get your carb dialed in properly. But you need to remember that timing does make a difference in AFR's . I believe that 1* of timing can make a .2 difference in AFR treading. Bagger and I covered this in a thread a while back.. I might be off with my ratio cause my memory isn't the greatest..

Example: a stock timing curve is running 25* advance at 2800 RPM so if you tipping in the throttle at that 2800 RPM the voes will ground advancing the timing 10* . So if your running say 13.8 AFR at 2800 and then the voes grounds advancing to 35* that 10* of timing advance will actually raise your AFR 2 full points 15.8 and yes that would cause detonation on a high compression motor... That's why I don't bother to use it... How much better mileage are you really going to get. 1-3 mpg? Maybe... Can't really confirm that but you can try a tank of fuel with the voes and a tank of fuel without the voes to confirm for your style of riding..

Part 2: no it's not going to make a difference in power because as soon as you throttle up and vacuum decreases it will break the ground to the voes and revert to the normal timing curve.. remember this as well. The more advance you run the hotter the motor will run. And just so you know I don't believe for tip in cruising you will get the same mileage.. it will drop. How much depends on the way you ride..

Like I said earlier I don't recommend a voes on a built hi compression motor.. Back in the day I was running Accell distributors on my SBC because the stock distributor that had vacuum advance, that was identical to the voes was not good for detonation even then with 98 octane fuel..
Oh wait...this is for a 'built' engine? I thought it was for any Harley big twin. I missed the built-up part somewhere, heh. Figures.

Thanks for the information though, settled a lot in my head.
 


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