Thanks guys for all the suggestions. Always good to see you John.

I took apart the primary and now know it's not a "not tightened completely" compensator issue, I'm leaning towards it being a transmission bearing issue.

I started the bike with the primary off and inspected the clutch as I engaged and disengaged it. Primary chain was good, compensator was good and seems to be functioning correctly, clutch did not visible wobble even after taking off the compensator and loosening the primary chain, it felt solid with no odd wobbles or wiggling.

The primary case was clean after having changed the fluid a few hundred miles ago. No marks on the case from anything rubbing.

As soon as the bike was rolling again the noises were coming from the primary, or being transmitted through the primary.

So, could I have noticed a bad clutch housing bearing even if I didn't dissemble the clutch pack?

It don't take long to get back in there. I thought it may have been an issue related to the compensator having not been re-secured, or possibly loosened slightly. I noticed a build up inside the compensator bolts threads of rust and lock tight and cleaned it, then ran it in and out on the main shaft to clear the threads even more and to know it was seating and reaching bottom. That's the only reason I didn't tear into the clutch.

I took a video of the primary when it was open and the bike was running. I engaged and disengaged the clutch while in neutral. I showed the short video to my Indie and he said everything looked normal and that he'd take it for a spin to see what he can hear.

So would I have been able to tell if it was the clutch hub bearing with the primary chain loosened (no tension on the clutch pack)?

It sounds like I'm headed back into the primary and digging deeper. Looks like a long and lengthy tear down, and possible a tranny rebuild.

I may take a short video of the sounds its making when it's rolling and try to post it.

BTW ... I am certain is has nothing to do with the bike simply rolling. The troubled noises seem to follow the speed of the transmission very closely, even changing speed with changes in gearing with the clutch lever pulled and the clutch disengaged.

Also, I got the bike up to speed and then shut it off and rolled a ways and there is no noise from wheel bearings. The bike coasted well and was absolutely silent.

 

Still sounds like a clutch basket bearing starting to go. when you pull the clutch in it put a load on the clutch assembly and can stop the noise coming from the bad bearing. By pulling the basket and replacing the bearing, you can look at the inner primary and main gear bearing too. Hope this helps.

 

You two guys are the only ones giving me some advice on this and I want to thank you. I know it's not a hot topic but I thought others might have had some advice too.

So, again thank you so very much.

I'm pretty certain I will be digging back into the primary tomorrow and hopefully have an answer to solve this mystery.

I did have two other Harley friends think the issues point toward the clutch hub bearing ... I hope so too!

 

I'm STILL betting it's the clutch bearing.

The main tranny bearing doesn't change speeds when shifting and this is the bearing that's going to make the most noise. It always follows the speed of the rear tire. (I myself have been installing my tranny and primary today after having the main transmission bearing replaced.) While you were in the primary you should have popped the clutch pack off of the main transmission shaft. Then you can spin the transmission shaft by hand and listen to the tranny without any of the primary being involved. In my case, I could tell right away that it was definitely the trans making noise and that at least the main bearing was bad.

 

Johnny I'm sure your not getting alot of input because this is a real tough situation to be giving advice on, I would generally go with the suggestion of changing the clutch bearing and see if that works. I've done both the clutch bearing and new clutch pack as well as the tranny rebuild.
I know my bike inside out and when something comes up I get down and personal with it. Just don't scrimp on any parts that are suspicious and you'll eventually find the problem.
I'll be following along.

 

This description makes me suspect the needle bearings in the main drive gear, because when the transmission is in 5th gear, there is no relative movement between the main drive gear and the mainshaft.

Also, when the clutch is engaged, there is no relative movement between the clutch hub and the outer shell,

But...It is hard to figure this type of problem from long distance.

 

Thanks for the input. I'm about an hour away from tear down and will take some photos of what's up.

I hope it's not any part of the tranny!

 

Don`t worry about tearing down a transmission, you have the skills to dismantle the primary, so you would have no problem with a trans, very straightforward.

 

Dan,

Thank you for the vote of confidence.

I started out at about 10 years old rebuilding lawn mowers into go carts. Mini bike at 12 and blew the motor up running without an air filter so I epoxied the case break, replaced the rod and put a few miles on it after that. Rebuilt it several times after that too.

I had a Kaw f-8 road and trail that I tore down several times. It had a bad gear, then a bent shift fork and finally I blew up the 250cc that was in it and found a "big horn" 350 with the "hop up kit" and went from about 20 HP to 37hp on my trail bike in a 250 frame.

So I have the skills, most of the tools, and the way life has been, the time too. (been off from a regular work schedule since Jan.)

It's been a good experience buying a needy '86. I don't regret it but it came with more issues than I expected and of course it's frustrating when one of your buds call and for the first time in 2 years said "hey let's load up the old ladies and ride Sunday. Maybe by Monday night or Tuesday it'll be back together.

BTW it's partially apart and draining the primary right now. I'm on a break and I'm doing about 3 things at once (got sidetracked). You know how it is!

 

I know all about side tracking ( I call it multi-tasking ), this is why my wife prefers me not to BBQ.