Wood TW-555 vs SE255 Cam Dyno Test Archive
#11
WOT vs partial
That wouldn't be new. Many tuners make dyno passes in the lower rpm's and lower gears during the tuning process. They use this info to make adjustments then repeat the passes. 80% throttle, 60% throttle, etc.
The objective is to recreate all real world riding conditions and tune for them. A reputable tuner will do this. A joe-blow dealership often tunes at WOT only but charges full price.
You don't see them posted because of their insignificance as a final picture.
If I am looking at someone elses sheet for power comparisons, I give a crap what his bike does at 20% throttle. Only my own bike matters at 20% throttle. Why? Because I won't be racing anybody at 20% throttle!
A WOT sheet still shows the torque measurement of the lower rpm's.
A low curve on the left side of the sheet will indeed prove your bike to suck while climbing the hills. A high number there will prove to be a pleasure in the mountains.
The WOT sheet tells me all I need to know about a build.
The objective is to recreate all real world riding conditions and tune for them. A reputable tuner will do this. A joe-blow dealership often tunes at WOT only but charges full price.
You don't see them posted because of their insignificance as a final picture.
If I am looking at someone elses sheet for power comparisons, I give a crap what his bike does at 20% throttle. Only my own bike matters at 20% throttle. Why? Because I won't be racing anybody at 20% throttle!
A WOT sheet still shows the torque measurement of the lower rpm's.
A low curve on the left side of the sheet will indeed prove your bike to suck while climbing the hills. A high number there will prove to be a pleasure in the mountains.
The WOT sheet tells me all I need to know about a build.
As far as real world conditions, I won't be racing anybody at all, and I would gamble that most of the riders out there aren't racing, either. As a matter of fact, the only time I can think of that I'm WFO is when I'm passing cars... so... let's see, I spend 95% of my time between 1/8 and 1/2 throttle.... torque curves at those throttle openings would mean a lot more to me as far as what this bike is going to feel like in normal day to day driving.
But, I can see your point - I guess for some riders, the only thing that really matters is how hard they can accelerate when they crack it wide open, and how the bike behaves the other 95% of the time is not as important. I can get that.
It's an interesting question - any input from other riders? How many people find a Wide Open Thottle dyno sheet to tell them everything they need to know about their bike, vs torque curves at different throttle openings?
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Faast Ed, I understand what you're saying. But I'm not suggesting dyno passes at lower RPMs or lower gears, I'm suggesting dyno passes at different throttle openings. And, as Jamie just proved in a previous dyno sheet, a low curve on the dyno sheet at WOT does not mean a low curve at part throttle, when he published a SE255/TW555 comparison in which the SE255 had significantly more torque between 2,000-3,000 at WOT but the TW555 had significantly more torque in the same range at 1/4 throttle. I would think that multiple passes at different throttle openings would give us a better picture of how this particular component would work in our own bike - in that case, we were comparing different cams.
As far as real world conditions, I won't be racing anybody at all, and I would gamble that most of the riders out there aren't racing, either. As a matter of fact, the only time I can think of that I'm WFO is when I'm passing cars... so... let's see, I spend 95% of my time between 1/8 and 1/2 throttle.... torque curves at those throttle openings would mean a lot more to me as far as what this bike is going to feel like in normal day to day driving.
But, I can see your point - I guess for some riders, the only thing that really matters is how hard they can accelerate when they crack it wide open, and how the bike behaves the other 95% of the time is not as important. I can get that.
It's an interesting question - any input from other riders? How many people find a Wide Open Thottle dyno sheet to tell them everything they need to know about their bike, vs torque curves at different throttle openings?
As far as real world conditions, I won't be racing anybody at all, and I would gamble that most of the riders out there aren't racing, either. As a matter of fact, the only time I can think of that I'm WFO is when I'm passing cars... so... let's see, I spend 95% of my time between 1/8 and 1/2 throttle.... torque curves at those throttle openings would mean a lot more to me as far as what this bike is going to feel like in normal day to day driving.
But, I can see your point - I guess for some riders, the only thing that really matters is how hard they can accelerate when they crack it wide open, and how the bike behaves the other 95% of the time is not as important. I can get that.
It's an interesting question - any input from other riders? How many people find a Wide Open Thottle dyno sheet to tell them everything they need to know about their bike, vs torque curves at different throttle openings?
I am positive my tuner has sheets with mine at different throttle openings from when he was tuning, but I had no compulsion to ask for them at the time. The left side of my WOT sheet seems to match the performance of my bike when doing my casual riding or passing cars.
But I do indeed do some racing with my buddies and occasional WOT blasts when alone.
I do see your point while cam shopping to see what they do at lower throttle openings. You have a legitimate point.
And, as Jamie just proved in a previous dyno sheet, a low curve on the dyno sheet at WOT does not mean a low curve at part throttle, when he published a SE255/TW555 comparison in which the SE255 had significantly more torque between 2,000-3,000 at WOT but the TW555 had significantly more torque in the same range at 1/4 throttle.
It would not have been practical for him to build an entire motor around each cam for a same day same dyno same conditions test.
If I were to use a part throttle sheet while researching a cam for myself, that sheet would need to be from a run where the cam was set at it's optimal recommended compression.
Low compression affects a cams performance significantly.
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02-11-2011 03:05 PM