Harley announces profits wiped out by trade tariffs
#101
02-09-2019, 05:53 AM
The last time we had an economy this great was in the 90s and early 2000s Harley sold 350K bikes a year and one had to wait months for them and many paid over MSRP. Showrooms were empty.
Today we are in a BETTER economy and Harley cannot sell enough bikes.....Doesn't bode well for the next recession. If Harley can't sell enough bikes in this economy, they cannot possibly last very long when the tide turns as it ALWAYS does,
Today we are in a BETTER economy and Harley cannot sell enough bikes.....Doesn't bode well for the next recession. If Harley can't sell enough bikes in this economy, they cannot possibly last very long when the tide turns as it ALWAYS does,
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mitchxout (02-09-2019)
#102
02-09-2019, 06:14 AM
I hear you, but that being said... and this is just my 2 cents...I don't think people are saying they were not always expensive. I think the point that is being made is that everyone has a breaking point. So in 2005 $18k for an Ultra was maybe OK... But now today an Ultra Limited is $30k + ttl... Maybe over the years that's not a huge jump, but now people are going.. Ah.. I'm not paying $30k for two wheels, that's just "too much" It's the same for pick-ups and large SUVs... Lately I hear more and more people say how expensive they are. I think what they mean is they've reached their breaking point for what they feel is reasonable. Again.. Just my 2 Cents...
I love Nissan cars and trucks. I am a retired traveling salesman and HAD to have reliable transportation in my job. Breakdowns were not something I could afford. Nissans never let me down. I was just pricing a new Nissan Rogue yesterday. Even with all the "extras" I wanted on it, it still was under $27,000. Heck, $27,000 won't even buy a Harley Limited. I am NOT going to spend more on a motorcycle that I do for a family vehicle. It just ain't gonna happen in my house.
And I'm not just blaming it all on Harley. Other bike makers are doing the same thing with pricing. And in my opinion it's been that way for accessories forever. It seems like if it has to do with motorcycles, makers can automatically charge 3 times what it's worth because us stupid bike owners will pay it. Sometimes I think we are our own worst enemy.
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jamala00 (02-09-2019)
#103
02-09-2019, 12:19 PM
Seasoned HDF Member
#104
02-09-2019, 02:29 PM
Road Captain
Sorry to disagree with you on the economy, but I don't see it like you do. We are NOT in a BETTER economy than the late 90's and early 2000's. Don't believe that stuff you see on TV and comments from politicians. Wages back then were better, comparatively, and there were more higher paying jobs. There was more U.S. manufacturing and jobs too. THAT is what is hurting Harley, and a lot of other Companies in the U.S. too. The entire world economy is just no where near like it was back then.
#105
02-09-2019, 07:02 PM
As far as the world economy goes,America leads other countries follow.We have the biggest economy in the world. China's economy is falling, Go check the latest news on the China markets,they are floating loans to banks to keep forclousers from happing. Facts are no American Harley rider I know of wants a Harley product made in China,India or Thailand. One of the reason I love my Harley is it was made in America by American's. I also love it when someone says how great these other countries area and how American is a bad place or how we should be like Europe or China. If they are so great and there economy is the best go live there. Personally I love America, I think all these idots who think Socialism is the answer are just that idots that do not know **** about history. The ***** we're socialist. The Chinese are communists most millennials don't know what either are. Build in America,buy American and keep are fellow citizens in jobs making America products. It funny to me how the Harley's CEO can blame tariffs on problems he and the board of directors have created. You don't see any of them taking cuts in pay or cuts in their stock options. Stop the bullshit ,you got the lowest coroporate tax rates in history, Fix the problems with the product, stop trying to save cost by cheaping it, lower the price.Learn to lead. Stopped the blame Trump bullshit and take some responsibility for the perdicament H D is in.
#106
02-10-2019, 05:55 AM
So what is your point you're trying to make with showing a graph? All this seems to show is that wages are up because of inflation? And and we all know that that the highest income bracket has fared better than all others. That's old news and we all know that.
Add a little comment here to your post and we can have a decent conversation about it.
If you trying to say that we didn't have easier access to money back in the 90's, and that money didn't go as far(which is the opposite of what I'm saying), I don't agree with you.
My stance is simply this: Wages and earnings for the vast majority of folks have NOT kept up with the rising costs of living in America. And in a lot of cases, wages have actually gone DOWN.
OK, now your turn to chime in. PLEASE. THis should be an interesting exchange.
Add a little comment here to your post and we can have a decent conversation about it.
If you trying to say that we didn't have easier access to money back in the 90's, and that money didn't go as far(which is the opposite of what I'm saying), I don't agree with you.
My stance is simply this: Wages and earnings for the vast majority of folks have NOT kept up with the rising costs of living in America. And in a lot of cases, wages have actually gone DOWN.
OK, now your turn to chime in. PLEASE. THis should be an interesting exchange.
Last edited by GOV5; 02-10-2019 at 05:58 AM. Reason: to add
#107
02-10-2019, 06:02 AM
Seasoned HDF Member
#108
02-10-2019, 06:16 AM
There is another poster here that I am asking to have a conversation with me, since he sent a picture of a graph as a response to one of my posts. I really don't know what his reply meant since he didn't comment on his graph. But I'm sure he will explain it soon..
But my whole point is that back then(1993) I agree with you. I lived thru that period. I don't care what graphs say or what the GOVT claims. In a Wages vs. Buying power comparison, we had it better back in 1993...for a lot of reasons. We are nor in an economy now that was anywhere near as good as it was then. And I don't think it ever will be again. I'm not being doom and gloom, it's just the way things are now in the World. WE all have to adjust to it.
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Stiggy (02-10-2019)
#109
02-11-2019, 04:26 PM
Road Captain
According to the Bureau of Labor Statistics consumer price index, prices in 2018 were 73.78% higher than prices in 1993.
You Sir have taken it in the butt, no doubt about it. After inflation you are 60% in the hole. I certainly understand that you have no interest in a $30,000 toy.
I don't think I'd buy a $30,000 Harley on an $85,000 salary regardless of what my past earnings were.
Last edited by HiDrag; 02-11-2019 at 04:29 PM.
#110
02-11-2019, 08:29 PM
Grand HDF Member
Harley profits
Reading all this I got ask in 1993 if you made 75k and today you make 85k did anyone invest any of those earnings in a 401k ? If so, how much do you figure your return on investment was over those last 26 years? I'LL bet is was alot more than the 30k cost of a new bike. If you got out of the market in 08 and never got back in you lost over 300 percent . If you can borrow against your 401, take a loan against your 401k and pay yourself back and go buy a new bike. If you didn't invest in a 401k or a investment account who's fault is that ?