Regarding the Indian Scout punishing the Harleys on the dirt track: When will the Motor Company have an answer?

 

 

Well, imho, when Harley takes the program away from Terry Vance. He may build great drag bikes, but he knows nothing about flat track racing. From what I've heard, it's not the power that's a problem, it's getting the bikes to "hook up" and get the power to the track. Gearing, chassis adjustments, handling, etc. are ALL a part of setting up a flat track motorcycle. One tooth up or down on a rear sprocket, a few pounds more or less air pressure in the rear tire, shock adjustment, handlebar angle, raising or lowering the forks on the triple tree, minor things like that, can mean a lot on a Mile dirt track. Harley has been embarrassed the last few years, and needs to get their act together soon. They have one on the most talented riders today in Sammy Halbert, and a very promising "up and comer" in the young Jared Vanderkooi, so it's really not a rider problem.

Halbert



Vanderkooi









Add in the problem that Indian opened up the $$$$ vault and hired the BEST three dirt trackers racing today....Jared Mees, Brad Baker (who unfortunately suffered a broken back in a racing accident and is currently paralyzed), and Bryan Smith. Bryan Smith went back to Kawasaki, and Brad Baker is no longer racing, so the 2019 Indian team is current champion Jared Mees, and the Bauman brothers, Bronson and Briar.




As far as the Honda comment, other than the under card 450 DTX class, where several privateers race converted Honda motocross bikes, Honda has no involvement in GNC racing. They have NO twin class racing program, haven't had since the mid-80's when Bubba Shobert was winning championships on a factory Honda RS 750, so that comment was apparently made by someone with no knowledge of current flat track racing.

 

Or it was made by someone who very much understands current flat track racing and the MoCo and realizes it will be a very long time before a HD is on the podium and you just can't get the sarcasm in their typing.

 

Didn't they just change the rules concerning throttle body size? I think they restricted Indian to 38mm while all other mfrs. are allowed 40mm.

 

That's correct along with several other changes that will benefit the MOCO. Indian is fine will all the changes except the throttle body change. They feel that is unfair and I tend to agree on that one.

But for HD to really succeed they need some ground up changes. #1 being the heavy cradle frame design. That is way outdated and needs revised to a trellis design for weight distribution. They also have a new production class this year, which HD has a great shot at taking with the 750 street platform. And the rule changes should help them some in the Pro-Class.

 

Genuine question: What difference does it make? My decision to buy a HD wasn't even slightly influenced by flat track racing success and I can't imagine anyone else's is either. Do they actually learn anything worthwhile to apply to the design of production bikes? Or is racing really just someone's vanity project?

 

Well, growing up in the 1950's with uncles who raced flat track on WR Harley Davidsons, then racing some flat track myself, plus being involved in the sport since I was a little boy, just planted the love of Harley Davidsons DEEP in my psyche. So, in my case.....Harleys and flat track definitely influenced my decision to buy and ride Harley Davidson motorcycles.

 

Yes, they absolutely learn worthwhile things from competitive motorsports; flat track included. Innovation in motorcycles over the years came first from a need for more speed and racers making bikes that were designed to go 40 miles an hour were made to go 80-100 miles per by proud creative owners, hillclimber bikes influenced dirt and trail bikes, those bikes influenced modern dirt bikes, and the list goes on. Same for car racing. Many things were tried in racing cars and then applied to street models later with even more refinements.

Some of Indian's recent success on the track created an interest in a street version of their bike, which then became the FTR1200 prototype, and now will be released to the streets as the FTR1200. And due to what they learned with the race motor the top end of the street motor is magnesium, the crank has been shaved down for better roll on power and several other things. The first American performance bike to wear an American name on the tank in decades. And that is pretty f..ing cool.And likely a 750 will follow.
...
What HD learns in the Street Class this year with the 750 Street on the track will influence that line of street bike eventually or will let them know what to change, etc. etc. etc.

Not to mention, Flattrack is experiencing a renaissance right now, which will influence younger riders thanks to improved attendance and televised races along with live streaming. And with younger riders in the singles competition and some new arrivals on the scene in the twins class more interest there too.

And look what Roland Sands has been doing creating interest with his touring Hooligan racing series. More influence there. Ducati with the Desert Sled's huge success influenced Triumph to build their old school scrambler. And on and on.

Competition and engineering advancements are the keys to the motorcycle's future for all brands...

 

It doesn't make that much difference in sales. Flat track racing was dying and hasn't really recovered yet. The only place I see it discussed is on HD and Indian forums. As far as the Scout, how many do you think Indian really sells in a year? Last year it was estimated Polaris sold 20,000 to 25,000 bikes and that was all models.