Hang in there until the Pan American comes out. Folks will forget about the FXDR and start on it.
Kinda sorta is the end of the world just talking about it. The only one missing from the death throes of the MoCo so far is that 'Custom' model with the wide Fat Bob style headlight. Too much fun with the Livewire, Pan America, and Street Fighter to notice that other new snake in the grass....
You have not looked at or ridden the 'competition' have you? Look at one of those 20k zeros, then look at a Versys 300. They are about the same size bike. By saying the Zero is a better choice is like saying a Versys 300 is a better choice over anything else of more stature. This is not an apples to oranges conversation except for the people that keep throwing Zero into the equation and saying it is better.
Now let me ask; are you going to buy a Livewire? I din't think so. Are you going to buy a Zero? If not then I have another question...for all the Yamahondakawazukis and Ducati's, BMW's, and every other brand of bike on the planet why are YOU not calling gasoline Harley's all ugly, failures, overpriced, etc? People are lining up to pile on Harley for making the Livewire but not a one is even interested in it. Why is that? Why over and over again in multiple threads are the same people bashing the Livewire and the other new bikes as the end of the company. Do people just want to see their handle in print or something? Why is this?
I didn't say the Zero is a "better" choice. And I said that it would be hard to compare E-bikes right now because the Livewire isn't out , and the other makers are releasing new, improved models. - did you miss that part? I'm judging it at face value - Harley Davidson, a company regarded by many as making overpriced, outdated bikes, releases the most expensive E-bike on the market. And from what I'm told by those who understand and know EV technology, it's not even the latest greatest EV technology.
So "no", wait, lets make that a resounding and emphatic "NO! - I will not buy the Livewire." Why? Because it's overpriced!! Would I buy an EV bike of any kind? Sure. If it was at the right price point and had the right performance, I would consider one.
As far as why are people lining up to bash the Livewire - because it's so bashable! You're one of the few that seems to embrace it's arrival. Great - are YOU going to buy one? I didn't think so.
You seem to lump me in with "the same people". I never said the Livewire, or any other bike was going to make or break the Moco. The Livewire is their first step into the EV market and I'm sure they will have better offerings that make more sense in the future. So I applaud their foray into EV vehicles. I truly believe it isn't if, but when we no longer drive/ride ICE vehicles. As far as the FXDR, I've said I don't hate it. Good for them thinking outside the box a little. But again, I feel it's too expensive. I would buy a BMW or KTM over that bike in a New York minute and put the other $4k in my pocket for hookers and blow.
Originally Posted by Mark Faulkner
So why not hold off with all the negativity until you get to actually try one?
Yes, it's very expensive, but so is every new Harley. Personally, i think the Livewire looks far better than any of the competition, but i don't really think it was designed to compete. It's a limited model from a luxury brand and it will sell to those it's marketed at.
Because all of my negativity is based on the price. I don't need to wait because no matter how good it is - it's too expensive. I guess I just don't understand the confusion.
Hang in there until the Pan American comes out. Folks will forget about the FXDR and start on it.
I actually like what I see of the Pan America, looks pretty cool. But I'd say that it doesnt seem differentiated from bikes in a similar class from other manufacturers. Point is Harley needs to *differentiate* in order to attract *new* customers, which they desperately need to do.
Just offering something that looks similar but for more money and less performance wont cut it.
I actually like what I see of the Pan America, looks pretty cool. But I'd say that it doesnt seem differentiated from bikes in a similar class from other manufacturers. Point is Harley needs to *differentiate* in order to attract *new* customers, which they desperately need to do.
Just offering something that looks similar but for more money and less performance wont cut it.
I didn't want to get jumped again by mentioning my skepticism on the Pan America. I will definitely hold criticism until I see and ride one. Much like I did with the FXDR.
But here's the thing, the Adventure market is huge with some very serious players. I don't know who the Pan America is made for. Is it an Adventure bike for the Harley faithful? Is it an Adventure bike meant to go head to head against the likes of the BMW GS? I guess time will tell.
Believe me - I would be thrilled if the company, located 20 miles from my door, the one that employs friends of mine, made a world class adventure bike. But I'm skeptical.
As far as the FXDR, I've said I don't hate it. Good for them thinking outside the box a little. But again, I feel it's too expensive. I would buy a BMW or KTM over that bike in a New York minute and put the other $4k in my pocket for hookers and blow.
You, my friend, won the internet today, lol.
And yes I agree, the FXDR IS expensive (As I have stated in this thread and others), but for ME, was worth every penny.
The one thing I do give the MoCO (Did I say that right ?), is the options... there are so many variants of the same style of riding (FXDR, Breakout, Fat Bob, as examples) that you have variety in the lines, compared to other manufacturers who may only have one or two types (especially in their cruiser lines)
Gomez I applaud you for not following the pack mentality that is sometimes displayed on this site. You know what you like and what appeals to you, that bike is not my style but I don't dislike it, and I don't make the payments so my opinion should mean nothing to you. Drive it and enjoy the hell out of it !!!
Yea, this pretty much sums it up. But, having a Road King and Heritage for comfortable cruising, and not one but two literbikes for when I feel the need for speed, the FXDR just doesn't cut it, especially for that inflated MSRP.
In all fairness, the FXDR looks much much better in person than on it's photos, but I'll pass, thanks. YMMV!
First, I'm not a crusty old pirate longing for the days of Evo Softails, or a skinny jeans Hipster proclaiming his singular love for the Iron Head Sporty on Youtube. I am on the young side and of the demographic that would be able to pay $25k for a bike.
The problem is, defining what a "Harley" is and why one would want it over a Japanese or European bike. If you load up Instagram or any social media with young guys, they are all rocking chopped and bobbed Sporties or popping wheelies on Dynas. That's what caught my attention to the Dyna. The whole riding experience is very different from the Metric bikes. The look, the sound, etc. Yes, it's not great at stopping, turning or speeding, but it does all those things "well enough" to have fun. If all out performance was my goal, there is an endless list of other more capable motorcycles that cost considerably less new and used.
It's like telling a Jeep Wrangler fan to just buy the vastly superior Toyota Tacoma. You just lose out on that whole "Wrangler" experience.
So when I see HD trying to make bikes that look and try to perform like their Metric competitors, but then cost 25% - 100% more; I'm given pause and filled with revolution. The FDXR is absolutely dog vomit ugly. The new Softail like is nice for softails, but compared to Dynas... once again, revolting. I don't care that it's a mono-shock and is quicker or performs better. If I wanted an ugly bike that had killer performance, I'd grab a Diavel (which has 3x the performance). The FXDR is marketed as some sort of performance bike, but it lacks the cutting edge sophistication of the V-Rod and the style and pedigree of the FXR. At $22,000, it's also at the extreme top end of the market and does not have a single superior characteristic over it's competition.
With that said, I really feel $13,000 is the magic number for younger buyers. Everyone I know that rides sees motorcycles as a toy and doesn't want to spend more then $5k cash or $200 a month on something. Anything more then that and its "****, I could get a damn nice truck for that". This is why DRZs, Groms, Ruckus, Ninja300s, Used Sportbikes, used Sporties, etc are so popular. You drop $3k and your having just as much fun as a dude that spent $22k on a fugly FXDR and is all concerned people don't think it looks cool.
Hell, want to impress the cool kids, roll up on a metal flake FXR with a Big-Bore and T-bars.
Not that big of a difference, so quit making Gold wing into this bad to the bone machine. All that new technology and still just barely ahead of 100 year old, air cooled, American iron. 114 cubic inch M8 is just couple of ponies shy to of Gold wing...... Plus dont have to worry about ridiculous maintenance cost of that wing, very few dealers around, and no way to work on it your self.
So why did you buy that expensive Harley you have a photo of in your signature? With other gasoline motorcycles as inexpensive as $4000 new I would have never guessed they would have sold that one for sooooo muchhhh.....
Someone is going to buy a Livewire so why don't you stop calling them stupid so they come around and tell us what it is like instead of spreading negativity.
...I bought my "expensive" Harley because it was 2yrs before I retired making $130K+ per year. Now I'm not. I didn't call the LiveWire stupid, you did, you mentioned it. I just stated like a ton of other people here for $30K, it's only going to sell at a fraction compared to the other much lower price e-bikes. It isn't an opinion, it's a fact. Stating facts has nothing to do with negativity.
03-19-2019, 02:40 PM
