Yes, I guess you get spoiled, spent all of my life up in NY, moved here to SC (South Carolina) 10 years ago.
It does get cold here in the winter at times and then at times its warmer.
I got out on the bike a while today but was the first time in a while, we have had a historic rain this past fall/early winter.
Today we got up to a high of 60 degrees but we are back to the 40s and 50s as a high this coming week.
There usually is a week or so during the winter where we can see lows in the low 20s and teens, then other weeks in the 50s and 60s we truly get caught between the warm of the South and Cold of the North any given week. Normally by the end of Feb/early March we are into spring and the 70s and higher, then bam, before you know it its summer full time for 4 months of 90+ temps.
Everything is relative, what I used to think was warm is now cold and what I used to think is hot is no big deal. During the summer, its rare to see daytime highs below 90 degrees for months and that doesnt bother me, I actaully enjoy it over the 50s and 60s. )
Here is my latest UOA on my 2013 Sportster - 5000 miles on the oil/filter, 15000 total miles on the engine.
Copper is finally coming down! Lead and tin are down.
I also had Blackstone do a particle count. This UOA was with the Harley Sportster Oil filter, 63805-80A. (20 micron standard filter)
The next UOA I will also get a particle count, that will be with the Mobil 1 M1MC-131 filter rated at 99.9% efficiency at 10 microns.
At about 1000 miles on this run I checked my plugs. The Front plug was gapped at 0.045 and the rear was at 0.035. I cleaned off a little corrosion from the top of the plugs and set the gap to 0.040.
The bike ran much smoother with the old plugs gapped at the proper 0.040" and it has improved even more with the new NGK DCPR7EIX Iridium IX plugs.
Year: 2013
Model: XL1200C
Miles: 15000
miles on fluid:10000
Fluid used: Red Line MT-90
Stock or modified: Engine, intake, exhaust all stock
clutch type: Screamin' Eagle Performance Clutch Kit-38002-04
Performance clutch kit converts the 8-plate clutch to a 9-plate design. The surface area is increased by 13%,
and the spring rate is increased by 10% for a combination that can handle over 115 ft-lbs of torque at the crank.
Kit includes Kevlar®-based friction discs and performance clutch spring
Trans fluid history-
1000 mile service - clutch adjustment HD SYN3 used
3150 miles - new Screamin' Eagle Performance clutch installed - HD SYN3 fluid
5000 miles service - clutch adjustment Red Line MT-90 fluid (this UOA)
Blackstone Comments-
There's some extra metal and silicon here, but we're thinking that those are just residual materials
from this transmission's wear-in. The high wear is from the parts developing their tolerances, while the
silicon comes from harmless sealers used during assembly. A lot of this should wash out with this change in
fluid. Universal averages show typical wear levels for this type of Harley Davidson transmission after ~5,700
miles on the oil. The viscosity was a bit thick, but we don't think that's a problem. Check back to start
building trends.
My comments-
I haven't found very many Harley Sportster transmission/Primary UOAs.
The Red Line MT-90 should have a 100 C viscosity of 15.6 cSt. So it didn't thicken, it sheared just a little.
I'm not sure if Blackstone was thinking it was Mt-85, 12.0 cST, or MTL, 10.4 cSt.
The dealer did use a little silicone on the clutch inspection cover gasket when the clutch was installed.
Maybe they also used some on the Primary cover, I haven't taken it off.
The Universal averages are for all the different oils that Blackstone has tested in a Sportster transmission.
So the wear elements will be relevant but not the additives, they would show a mix of Auto Trans fluid, motor oil, gear oil
and whatever else someone has run in the primary/transmission.
This run was started with about 2000 miles on the new clutch so a little more iron from the new steel plates wouldn't be unusual.
I ended up with about the the universal averages for iron with almost twice the miles.
Code:
2013 XL1200C
Total miles 15000
Miles on oil 10000
Date 3/26/2016
Oil Brand Red Line
Type MT-90
Universal averages
ALUMINUM 82 9
CHROMIUM 0 1
IRON 58 51
COPPER 21 6
LEAD 2 1
TIN 0 1
MOLYBDENUM 16 189
NICKEL 1 0
MANGANESE 1 1
SILVER 0 0
TITANIUM 0 0
POTASSIUM 2 5
BORON 137 160
SILICON 49 18
SODIUM 2 8
CALCIUM 2922 2458
MAGNESIUM 109 121
PHOSPHORUS 1953 1086
ZINC 2199 500
BARIUM 0 0
SUS @ 210F 77.2
cSt Viscosity @ 100C 14.83
Flashpoint F 440
Fuel %
Antifreeze %
Water % 0.0
Insolubles % TR
TBN N/A
TAN N/A
Im very happy with this oil, will now have been using it for its 5th oil change. No intention of switching, in fact just ordered 4 more gallons for the next two years.
This oil saw a mix of (approx) 60% interstate up to 80 MPH, 30% local up to 60 MPH, 10% heavy traffic. Anywhere from flat SC riding to the Smoky Mountains of NC and TN.
Late spring and summertime temps 90 to 103.
Average oil temp falls within what Harley calls normal 230 degrees.
Normal for me was 220 to 245. highest I measured was 264 degrees.
I'm a little concerned about the copper, but I am seeing other reports with higher levels. After the 1st engine puked out before 10K I might be a little hyper sensitive.
I'm a little concerned about the copper, but I am seeing other reports with higher levels. After the 1st engine puked out before 10K I might be a little hyper sensitive.
============================
Just an observation:With only 2,600 miles on the HD syn3 oil the Zinc-1042ppm / Phos-764ppm anti wear agent lvl (ZDDP) it had is marginal @ best for a lrg v-twin bike motor .
A min of 1250-1300ppm zddp to max of approx 1800ppm zddp is where you want to be with v-twin motorcycle oil.
Thats why for example M1's-vtwin syn 20-50 has 1700ppm zddp,amsoil MCV syn 20-50 bike oil has 1400ppm zddp,Brad Penn Grade-1 bike oil has approx 1500ppm zddp,spectro bike oil has approx 1500ppm zddp/anto wear lvl for good reason .
Thats because over the yrs the oil & engine mfg's found in testing that 1400ppm-1700ppm zddp anti wear lvl is in fact where you want to be along with a quality base stock oil & quality chem additive pkg too. v-twin motorcycle oil.
So point is why use an oil with marginal @ best anti wear agent lvl when there are better choices avail @ approx same cost or not much more that have a considerably more robust anti wear agent lvl that also have quality base stock oil & quality chem additive pkg too.
That's why i use (rec too) using spectro motorcycle oil (Semi-blend & or full syn) thats specifically designed & formulated for HD's motor/prim case/trans in our bikes.
Would also rec using M1's v-twin & or Amsoil MCV both 20w-50 syn oil in an HD v-twin & M1-syn 75w-90 or 75w-140 rear oil in the trans too.
But i am not a fan of using or rec 20-50 motorcycle oil in an HD prim case though HD,M1 & other oil mfg's state it's ok to use in that app.
That's why i use & or rec oil thats specifically engineered & formulated for use in an HD primary case vs motor oil that's somewhat of a comprimise in a prim app.
Latest UOA on the right.
Engine is all stock, only change has been NGK iridium plugs DCPR7EIX.
Copper is down almost 50% again, maybe it will down to "normal" after a couple more oil changes. Lead and tin were also down.
Aluminum and iron are both less than half the universal averages from Blackstone in twice the miles. the 2500 mile averages are Alum - 5 and Iron - 11.
The insolubles are down to just a trace, so there isn't much oxidation or blow-by past the rings
I used a Mobil 1 M1MC131 oil filter this time and have the particle count below. The Mobil 1 filter hotline told me it was 99.9% efficient at 10 microns.
The oil was just a little cleaner especially in 4 and 6 micron numbers.
The first particle count was using the HD standard Sportster oil filter. 63805-80A / 63796-77A They are generally believed to to be a 20 micron nominal filter (although HD doesn't list any rating)
I keep the data in an Excel spreadsheet and used this link to do the formatting above. Copied the cells from Excel and pasted into the INput. I just copied the output table from the web page and put it in "Code" tags. https://senseful.github.io/web-tools/text-table/
Just an observation:With only 2,600 miles on the HD syn3 oil the Zinc-1042ppm / Phos-764ppm anti wear agent lvl (ZDDP) it had is marginal @ best for a lrg v-twin bike motor .
A min of 1250-1300ppm zddp to max of approx 1800ppm zddp is where you want to be with v-twin motorcycle oil.
Thats why for example M1's-vtwin syn 20-50 has 1700ppm zddp,amsoil MCV syn 20-50 bike oil has 1400ppm zddp,Brad Penn Grade-1 bike oil has approx 1500ppm zddp,spectro bike oil has approx 1500ppm zddp/anto wear lvl for good reason .
Thats because over the yrs the oil & engine mfg's found in testing that 1400ppm-1700ppm zddp anti wear lvl is in fact where you want to be along with a quality base stock oil & quality chem additive pkg too. v-twin motorcycle oil.
So point is why use an oil with marginal @ best anti wear agent lvl when there are better choices avail @ approx same cost or not much more that have a considerably more robust anti wear agent lvl that also have quality base stock oil & quality chem additive pkg too.
That's why i use (rec too) using spectro motorcycle oil (Semi-blend & or full syn) thats specifically designed & formulated for HD's motor/prim case/trans in our bikes.
Would also rec using M1's v-twin & or Amsoil MCV both 20w-50 syn oil in an HD v-twin & M1-syn 75w-90 or 75w-140 rear oil in the trans too.
But i am not a fan of using or rec 20-50 motorcycle oil in an HD prim case though HD,M1 & other oil mfg's state it's ok to use in that app.
That's why i use & or rec oil thats specifically engineered & formulated for use in an HD primary case vs motor oil that's somewhat of a comprimise in a prim app.
Happy motoring.
scott
Points well made !
I never understood the esoteric brag ie. "I buy my automotive xyz brand oil at Wally World and save $$ over xyz's "motorcycle oil". Oils, even the most expensive ones, are such a minor cost component of running a motorcycle that it makes such parsimonious ingenuity laughable. Motorcycles are different. Thats why they make different oil for it,,, not a difficult concept at all.
01-16-2016, 03:11 PM
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