'75 FXE.

Pulled the points cover off and the point plate and advance weights for routine maintenance. Found that the weights were not providing advance as they were frozen on their pivots. A couple shots of Seafoam penetrant and the weights were working fine. Followed that up with a drop of synthetic 30 weight on the pivots.

Slide the advance mechanism back on, making sure the pin is on the slot on the shaft.

Then put the cam mechanism on, matching the notched side with the pin on the advance mechanism.

Tightened the retainer bolt and made sure the points cam moved easily to advance the points plate.

Replaced the points plate, pulled some 2000 grit wet/dry through the points to clean them.

Checked the condensor and switched ignition wire connections.

Rotated the motor until the points arm was on the highest point of the points cam lobe.

Set the gap at .020 since I didn't have feeler for .18

Tightened the points arm and re-checked the gap.

Connected the test light to the points lead and ground.

Pulled the intake valve pushrod cover retainer on the front cylinder, the one next to the carb intake.

Rotated the engine with the kicker until the intake valve raised then lowered.

Finished rotating the motor in the correct direction with rear tire and trans in 4th until the backside of the small flywheel TDC dot was positioned at the backside of the timing window.

Rotating the points plate, the test light stays out no matter how far it is moved in either direction.

Manually lifting the points arm causes the light to come on.

Rotating the motor causes the light to come on/off.

Taken it apart 3 times and get the same results.

Hence the WTF in the in the heading. Has to be something simple, but clearly above my skill level.

Looking for some help from the brethren.

 

Condenser maybe..shorted???
I don't do it that way....
I generally get the advance Timing mark in the window... then turn the Advance cam to break the points...
Ensure you are looking at the correct mark. for the year of your crank... as I think you may have a later shovel crank... the one with the Lazy 8 or "Dot" for the advance mark so if set with the Line... yer already past advance mark and moving to TDC...

 

Thanks RacePres,

The manual indicates that TDC on my '75 should be the small drilled dot, advance should be the vertical line.

I believe that my brother had the motor balanced. Possibly wherever he sent it to gave him a different set of flywheels.

I'll see if static timing works using the vertical line as TDC.

 

Dropped a wooden dowel rod in the front cylinder

TDC is the vertical line, not the drilled dot.

That is contrary to what the service manual indicates for my year.

Still can't get the points to open at TDC though.

Spinning the motor and watching the front cylinder intake pushrod, the light comes on just before the front cylinder intake pushrod starts to lift and stays on all the way through the rod moving up and opening the intake valve.

Then goes out just before the pushrod drops.

If I read correctly, the longer duration lobe times the rear cylinder, and the shorter duration lobe times the front.

It's as if the point cam lobe is in the wrong position.

But the slotted end of the cam lobe is mated with the pin that sticks up in the advance unit.

If flipped 180, it looks as if the bolt that holds the points cam and advance weights in place would contact the cam lobe, preventing the weights from advancing timing.

I'm using the pushrod tube nearest the carb/intake port on the front cylinder for the visual indication that the front cylinder is on the compression stroke.

Has to be something simple.

 

Just pushed on the points plate as hard as reasonable in advance direction.

If I advance the points plate as far as possible, the points open about an inch or so past the TDC mark on the flywheel.

Still not making sense.

 

I don't believe you want the points open at TDC... except maybe with No Advance at the mechanical mechanism...
Put the advance mark in the hole...with the front cylinder at compression stroke [very important] I remove the condenser to access the Rotor more easily... then turn the rotor [against the Springs]... it is timed when the points jut open [a tiniest bit] at full mechanical advance...
All I do.... but I can't see yer setup from here...


Edit; If it continues to confound... Drop me a PM and I will give you my cell number... then you can send pics, and we can get this via Message...

 

the advance units don't come back to life after they seize up and you sand - blow torch - then hit with a jewelers hammer <dont care first thing is buy a new one

second thing is figure out the advance mark and turn the new advance ( the bearing unit is the best one ) to full and static set it that way as its the correct way - with a new set of points and condenser

anything else you do will become a complete waste of time and effort

 

John,

Always appreciate your guidance.

The advance mechanism and points have about 4,000 miles on them. They are US made items that were recommended by the ninjas on this board (possibly you).

When I installed the advance mechanism I didn't add additional lube as it didn't seem to need it. When I pulled it yesterday, there was no visible issue but apparently some very fine rust inside the pivot pin that froze the mechanism. A shot of Seafoam penetrant and minor effort had the advance unit functioning like new. So I think all is good there. The points - don't recall the manufacturer but they appear to be solid copper. I recall they were not inexpensive. The contact surfaces are flawless - no pits or irregularities whatsoever. The condenser was swapped for a new one at the same time.

I'm where I am because I read that the right way to time the machine was to do it with the advance mark in the timing window, manually advance the cam mechanism, then rotate the points plate until the test light just starts to light up.

I had ordered a device that was supposed to enable that only to find that the fit was for a larger cam lobe than that on my shovel. So into the trash bin that went. I have some needle nose pliers with a 45 degree bend at the end, put electrical tape on those to keep from scarring the cam lobe but still couldn't get a good grip. So maybe I need to make my own tool to fit the cam lobe.

I won't be able to take another run at it until a couple weekends from now.

 

they do actually make a tool for that that locks it in the advance location and its not expensive as I remember - I never bought one as I made my own before they were selling a tool

so from your explain your all good - on advancer units a found a grease called viper lube, but I am not fixing one bike at home, its great for small things that need a super slippery light coating

 

Time to upgrade