Hey FLS103 check this out....a 103 B motor like yours, 2-1 pipe like you, 57h cams like you and dyno in std.....see I told you the numbers were around here for that set up.

 

I wanted to do a 107 but was short on cash so I just did cams..
Back to the OP. There are lots of good drop in cams, if you plan on getting a dyno tune you might ask the tuner which cams he likes.

 

If you don't believe it, it's on a thread from today on dyno results. 57h cams. So how is your SAME set up in std 9-10 more than this guy?........happy dyno.

 

I believe it. Looks low for a 57H though. Lots of stage one builds with a good 2:1 make those numbers. Maybe the guy didnt get the o ring on the back of the cam plate seated right and its sumping.
EDIT: Seems like you like to argue and stir up $hit, you posted the same no name sheet on the other dudes dyno thread for some reason. Me and dude don't have the same set up. Different pipes, different tire size (yes that makes a difference), different tuner (he has SERT, I have powervision). I don't know everything and I admit it. You don't know everthing but you act like you do. We have hijacked this dudes thread. Not going to argue with you and kill his thread more.

 

FLS103 I'm not trying to stir up at all, simply illustrate that I not only have a bagger, dyna, and a softail that I personally have modified all the engine work in various stages along the way and have had these bikes always dynod on a HD dealership dyno (which tend to be regularly calibrated). And having seen hundreds of dynos from various dealerships and indy shops over many years, I can tell you the B motors are always lower performers as you have agreed (counterbalancers, heavier) and your claim of 114tq 96hp STD is not consistent with hundreds of legitimate dyros. Not trying to burst any bubble here, but your dyno sheet is misleading to other B motor guys looking at cam upgrades. There is no way your motor made 9-10 more than the guys sheet I posted (same set up), maybe a different 2-1 but that's not going account for 9-10 hp/tq. You may have that "HAPPY DYNO" we all hear of now and then. Or you have the rare softail that trumps most others if you rather believe that.

And as far as the guys 57h thread he started, if someone is going to start a thread with their dyno sheet and hang it out there voluntarily then they can expect either praise, criticism, or comparisons.

 

I don't believe my bike trumps all other softails. I do know for a fact that the 57H can go mid to high 90's in an A motor, mid to low 90's in a B motor. Lots of dyno's at lots of indy shops and dealers have shown this.
I also know that there are no magic cams.
You stick a dyno sheet up with the information cropped off the top and don't even mention what your magic cams are, I bet the cams compare pretty close to the 57H in specs if they are a drop in. The lift will be somewhere between .550" and .585", the valve timing will be pretty close.. Tell me what these magic cams are oh great and wise one!
Then when you tell me what your magic cams are go to the Harley tech talk site and look at all the dynos of 57H build that hit from 90 to 100hp that are tuned by indy shops AND Harley dealers across the country. I have witnessed dynos in three different states put up these numbers. Dude a good stage one will put up close to the numbers of the other guys 57H dyno.

 

There's no harm in disagreeing.

But taking into account the other 57h guys sheet, and places like Laharley in Lewiston's various 57h dyno runs that 100% support my point.

You see FLS103, I'm not sure you know enough about how components work enough to debate with me on this one. For example: the best tq cam stock engine 2-1 pipe bagger will reach the 112 tq area at best on a legit dyno because of the longer pipe which aids in tq. So combine your shorter 2-1 pipe and B motor, how do you think you "legitimately" can hit that number? Unless you have the magic cam and/or bike.

The sheet i posted is a bagger set up properly w one of the highest tq cams there is for a bolt on.

PLUS you referenced the .555-.585 lift specs in trying to guess the cam profile and compare. What you seemingly don't know is stock heads won't even flow enough past low .500's lift making the higher lift irrelevant when you seem to think it matters. Keep reading..keep learning. I never claim to know all, I just know this is what I've learned and seen over the years.

 

My reference to lift specs was based on the limits of stock springs and the fact that most drop ins are in part based on the limits of the stock springs. The lift of the cams is not the only factor to consider when talking about the flow limits of the stock heads or torque numbers. Valve timing, duration and overlap also come into play. Most major cam companies drop in 103 cams are in fact in that lift range, they might know a little more than both of us put together. Some feel the shorter duration, higher lift cams offer more velocity which can benefit flow more than volume.
I agree with your statement on pipe length, my tuner tried to talk me into a longer can. The reason I went with the short upturned pipe was to prevent dragging the pipe on my lowered bike. You did not mention head pipe length or diameter, both are very important. My head pipes are stepped (as most good pipes are) and smaller in diameter at the first step than most off the shelf pipes which helps torque.
Some of my torque could be because I have lowered my gearing. Also have a larger ported TB and injectors that I bought when I was going 107". Didnt really need it for the stage two 103" but the tuner and Jamie at Fuel Moto both advised me to run it anyway since I already had it, they both said it might pick up a little.
While I am fairly new to Harleys this is not my first rodeo, I have built oval track engines for decades. The operation of the internal combustion engine is not rocket science, pretty simple actually.
My point is, many bikes from dynos all over the country hit numbers like my bike with drop in cams, many make better numbers. The guy who tuned my bike has a bagger with 57H cams, power duals and supertraps. His bike made more tq to the left and more HP to right than mine, my hp was less but tq to right was better.
I still think a stage two 103 should hit at least 90 + hp and 105+ tq. That other 57H graph you show looks low.
You still have not shared your info from the first sheet you posted....

 

Come on guys, we all agree to disagree. This is taking this thread nowhere. I don't have any real knowledge of the "science of speed" so I'm trying to read up on a build before I spend my cash. Seems like whatever each of you did would be good enough for me. I'm just looking for reliability.

 

Sorry. Like I said earlier. There are a lot of good drop in cams out there that will give close to the same results. Woods, Andrews, Tman, S&S and a few other companies all make great cams. I called the companies and got their recommendations for my application, did a bit of research and talked to the guy who was tuning my bike then ended up with the 57's. Bike runs strong and I am happy.
As far as the dyno, they all vary. Numbers dont really mean anything, my main objective when I got mine tuned was to ensure it was running to full potential. Got it tuned pretty close myself but I could tell the difference after it was professionally tuned. Smoother power, better milage, runs cooler, starts quicker. Sorry I took part in blowing up your thread.