How many AT sessions were run?

 

2009 FLHX:
96ci
Arlen Ness Big Sucker
Dave Mackie 575 cams
V&H 450's
Evo Industries 49 tooth clutch sprocket
PV - Auto Tune w/WB O2's

DFCO?

The first column (10kpa) can't be achieved on my road dyno.

20kpa is always decel down to 2k rpm then bumps over to the 30kpa column. I've lowered the 127's down and they come right back.


More of that secret info?

The thing runs ok, I'm just chasing the VE's.
I changed my setting to 30kpa today after reading this. Bike apart right now and also raining cats & dogs so no tuning today.

 

Usually 3 20-30 minutes sessions.

 

I would re load the original tune you started working with and then follow the same process you used before, now that you reset the PV to exclude data under 30 Kpa. Then compare the results with what you posted above. Of course I'm a data/log junkie and sit and stare at this **** for hours when I'm working with my bike.

 

Deceleration Fuel Cut Off ...you see it in your logs ...the injector pulse width drops to 0. Mine seems to kick in somewhere just below 20.

Here's the thing ...you're cruising along the road at zero load so your kpa is wobbling around at idle ish numbers. My idle kpa is about 33 for example so if anything less that 30 was ignored, then a large chunk of the data collected while tootling along on no load would be ignored...

...no one has explained why you would want to do that?

BTW Closed-loop works all the way down to DFCO ...well mine says 18kpa anyway so you can ignore all you want, but CLI/AFF are going to kick right back in regardless of what you try to ignore. Plus THERE HAS TO BE A NUMBER IN THE TABLE so where do you get one from

So, unless this ignore anything under 30kpa is supposed to be supported by some more info and other config settings ...no one is telling from what I've been able to find.

 

Gordon,

IMO and only my opinion, those areas that you talking about are not stable enough or don't react well to the standardized calculations of an "auto tune" program. From the books I have read on tuning idle is the most unstable and erratic area of engine operation. Back in the car and carburetor days we used to turn the idle screw up to keep the motor running while making carb and timing adjustments going back and forth between the two and slowly backing the idle down to where it should be. This is where the experience and expertise of a Dyno Tuner (person) comes into play. Things like exhaust reversion, valve overlap, cam timing all come into play. The AT programs only take into account the data from the sensors, an experienced tuner has the ability to take that data and observe how the bike is running and determine weather or not changes need to be made. The manufactures of these "auto-tune" products do a very good job of marketing these products as a DIY replacement for a dyno tune and THEY ARE NOT.

 

I do completely agree.

I wouldn't touch "autotune" with a barge pole other than as something of a first pass, get-me-started kind of thing. The point was though, I use something else (Excel and MLV and hours staring at logs)

So telling someone not to let the little box touch the under 30kpa stuff is fine, so long as we tell them to get it done some other how ...like once the bike at least runs, get it to a professional tuner to finish off the job.

If there had been more interest in tuning Harleys and more pro shops over here I would certainly have been there!

Mind you, I don't have a TTS or any experience on VTune3...

 

I think the biggest problem with any of these products is people don't bother to read ALL of the instructions/literature that come with it. It's just "the guy on the phone said to plug it in and ride it and it will be as good as can be" and then it's not and some of them end up here bashing the product. It's a tool, and it's only as good as the person using it.

I learned a great deal just from reading what came with my Screaming Eagle tuner when I bought it, so much in fact that when I went back to my dealer and tried to discuss some of the things I had learned they had never heard of them. They just pick out a tune, load it and ship the bike out the door. I have since moved on to the Power Vision for two reasons, one you can change gear ratios and two is their tune license program.

Tuning areas under 30kpa can still be done by DIY its just a cumbersome trial and error process

 

Well after spending $400 on a "professional tuner" (that came highly recommended by my local dealer no less) I was not impressed with the tune he put on my PCV. I decided to ditch the PC and bought a PV from Fuel Moto. The stock tune they sent me is miles better than the PCV with dual band sensors and $400 Dynotune. I only wish you could get a money back guarantee on a "professional tuner". This guy was arrogant and thought he crapped ice cream. He didn't do squat for my bike. Since the $400 investment in a live tune turned out to be a complete waste of money. I would never get another dyno-tune. Why would I. As the saying goes, "Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me."

Are there good tuners out there? I don't doubt that there are. Is the tuner you went to any good? Only you can answer that. My answer is no. I will spend $400 on a device that I can work with rather than pay a guy the same money only to flush it down the drain.

 

I understand your point, I have had a less than satisfactory experience with a local dyno tuner, like I have said before the tuning device is only as good as the person using it. The PV combined with Fuel Moto's support is hard to beat. My experience with them has been nothing but good. Tuners are like any other skilled profession, some in the business are really good and some are really bad. In my 25+ years as a diesel mechanic I have found that the more arrogant they are the worse they are at their job at least in my field.