Sportster Models 883, 883 Custom, 1200 Custom, 883L, 1200L, 1200S, 1200 Roadster, XR1200, and the Nightster.
Sponsored by:
Sponsored by:

So you want your sportster to handle better in the twisties?

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
  #1  
Old 05-26-2011, 12:45 PM
Osco's Avatar
Osco
Osco is offline
Account Deactivated
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Central Florida
Posts: 1,757
Likes: 0
Received 8 Likes on 4 Posts
Cool So you want your sportster to handle better in the twisties?

Well then the first thing to modify Is not the bike, It's YOU.
The oldest safety lesson Is also the fastest way around
a corner, "Slow In Fast Out".
You want to smoothly trade braking traction for cornering
traction, then trade on to acceleration traction. All this must be a
seamless flow because a "Settled Bike" Is a safe bike.
The Basic's,, roll off the throttle never shut it.
Squeeze the brakes never grab em.
Do the bulk of your braking before corner entry but
Don't suddenly release the brakes when you start the corner entry.
This unsettles the bike and you have to wait for It to settle
before you have any real control.

Trail Braking:
Why do It, Whats It for ? Setting Speed Precisely:
Trail Braking's bottom line is safety. The ability to trail-brake allows you
to set your cornering speed closer to the Apex which is the slowest point of
a corner. Those who use their brakes in a straight line and then let go of
them to steer their bikes are deciding very early in the corner what speed
they need. If you always ride the same road thats ok as long as there are no
mid-corner surprises.
But the ability to use your brakes while leaned over will allow speed
adjustments all the way through the corner, even past the apex if
neccessary.

How to practice It, VERY EASY untill you fully master It !

What It does,,,
Gives the bike a very balanced feel,
Gives you far better speed control In turns,
Gives you a better shot at sudden directional changes In turns especially
If you encounter an object on the road.

How to do It,
Trail the brakes off, thats easing off the brakes as you lean.
I often start my lean while I'm still at 50% brakes.
As the bike reaches half my Intended lean angle I'm at about 15% brakes.
As I get close to full lean angle I will often still be at 5% brakes,
then completing a steady decrease to zero right before the Apex.
If I need to I can continue very light braking right past the Apex.

Some think the apex Is the half way point of a turn. This line of thinking
Is wrong and can be dangerous especially If the turn Is a decreasing
radius turn or a blind turn or a turn on a down hill grade.
For Me the Apex Is the slowest point of a turn.
If the Apex Is the slowest point In a turn how do you know where It Is ?
In an unknown corner It Is the point where you can see the corner exit.

Makes sense right ! If Its the slowest point that means you can now start to roll on throttle
and That should not ever start Untill you actually see the exit.

Confused are we ?,,,another way I look at It,,,
I trail brake in and power out,,always
even If only a tiny bit. I Keep a wide line till I see the corner exit.
Then and only then do I go for the Inside line.
When I transition from trail Braking and my corner speed Is set,
I look for the Apex, again, for me this Is the Slowest point because
At that Point I begin to accelerate out of the turn,,
I use acceleration to assit In "Standing the Bike up"
which IMO feels far more stable than just steering the bike out.

My Goal,,ONE steering Input on entry and no other Bar Input changes after that.
I wan't all my traction available for braking, lean angle and acceleration.
Any directional changes after the entry are with careful brakes and
throttle.
YES you can safely use brakes IN the corner If a shut throttle is not quite
enough. But you better be smooth and know the light touch.
Also I've learned how easy Cagers get spooked In multi lane corners...
I track a Car type line because using the whole lane on a bike,,,diving for
an apex scares the crap outta many cagers.

Maintenance Throttle:
If your still a little Hot,,Keep the throttle shut but If your speed
is set correctly sneak on a tiny amount of throttle. Not enough to
accelerate the bike, just to maintain speed.
This Is called, "Maintenance throttle".
why do this ? read on grasshopper,,,,,,,

If you do it right the chassis will not get Unsettled.
Remember maintenance throttle,,
When you lean a bike over the tire has a smaller diameter
on the side wall where your contact patch Is now and that means
a lower final drive ratio.
You must add a small amount of throttle to maintain speed.
Why you ask ?
Basic riding here,,If the bike slows the lean angle decreases
or your radius tightens.
That means another steering input and there ya go bobbing thru
a corner like a rookie.
The other advantage of maintenance throttle Is It takes a little weight
off the front tire and transfer's It to the rear tire making the rear
tire contact patch larger.
This keeps the front tire from being overloaded and gives the
bike an amazingly balanced feel.

The Best corner Safety formula of all Is this:
Radius equals MPH, MPH equals radius and Radius equals safety
Rushing the corner entrace, carrying too much speed and being forced to stay on the brakes too long.
This Is scary and makes you turn In too early. This low tight corner
entrance feels safe because there is lots of comfortable pavement there.
But it makes the turn's radius tighter.
This is a safety formula and It simply means, the wider
the radius the faster you can ride at a given lean angle, or the less lean
angle you need at a given speed.
A corner's maximum radius can be enjoyed only if the rider has the disipline
to run a wide entrance line DEEPER into the corner.
And to do this you gotta know how to be smooth and not enter a corner
with a unsettled bike, remember, rolling off the throttle, smoothly squeezing
the brakes, not grabbing them or slamming the throttle shut.
Here is the secret ! Its simple but often overlooked,
By taking a wider entrance line you wil be effectively enlarging the radius
of the turn thus reducing needed lean angle for a given speed.
This wide entrance line is as close as you will come to a free lunch.
Think Wide entrance line, and great brakes gives a good turn in.

Now the proper way OUT of a corner...
It Is not just a bar steering input, It Is not just pushing on the outside
grip. This works but there Is another steering control that will enhance
a corner exit.
Use the throttle to stand the bike up out of the corner.
When you roll on steady smooth throttle the bike will maintain that
Oh so safe feeling you can only get when a bike Is settled.
DO NOT try to be fast untill you are smooth.
Feed your brain visual info,, Look to the entrance and when you
see it look to the apex,,when you see it look to the exit.
Once you are smooth you WILL be faster,,
Now is the time to start Bike Mods.

Here Endeth The Lesson
 

Last edited by Osco; 05-26-2011 at 12:54 PM.
  #2  
Old 05-26-2011, 12:59 PM
1200Cdriver's Avatar
1200Cdriver
1200Cdriver is offline
Road Warrior
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Colonial Beach, Virginia
Posts: 1,599
Likes: 0
Received 10 Likes on 9 Posts
Default

As I learned in Moto Cross, smooth is fast and rough herky jerky is slow. I was a race starter in W.Va for a while and many times saw guys look like they were going fast but the stop watch said they were going slow. The fast guys looked like ballet dancers, smooth, fluid and effecient. Like fast guitar players they used economy of motion.
 
  #3  
Old 05-26-2011, 01:41 PM
hondofiero-Leather Pro's Avatar
hondofiero-Leather Pro
hondofiero-Leather Pro is offline
Intermediate
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 46
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default

Great post Osco! Only thing I would add is a little more emphasis on road familiarity, especially bumps. I remember as a kid riding a little Suzuki 90 around a corner as fast as I could. I was familiar with the curve and at around 45 mph it wasn't a problem, but I was shooting for 60. When you hit a big bump, the tires will go airborn for a brief moment, not a problem when going straight, but in a curve it can get a little hairy. I had forgotten about the bumps just before the apex of the curve and I can remember the rear wheel going airborn and of course away from my line until it grabbed again. I still don't know how I made it through all 3 of those bumps going that fast, but luckily I did. I will say that it was the scariest moment I ever had on a bike. That was 35 years ago and I'm sure the suspension on that little Suzuki is not near as good as what we have now, but I am still cautious of bumps in corners.

Hondo
 
  #4  
Old 05-26-2011, 01:49 PM
jcallesano's Avatar
jcallesano
jcallesano is offline
Road Warrior
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Boston
Posts: 1,785
Likes: 0
Received 6 Likes on 5 Posts
Default

good stuff!
 
  #5  
Old 05-26-2011, 02:03 PM
RacingJake's Avatar
RacingJake
RacingJake is offline
Tourer
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 341
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Default

That's the way to do it !!

The fun part is when you come up on water flowing across the road in a tight bend or a bunch of sand that's when the real excitement begins.
 
  #6  
Old 05-26-2011, 02:40 PM
Osco's Avatar
Osco
Osco is offline
Account Deactivated
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Central Florida
Posts: 1,757
Likes: 0
Received 8 Likes on 4 Posts
Cool

Originally Posted by RacingJake
That's the way to do it !!
The fun part is when you come up on water flowing across the road in a tight bend or a bunch of sand that's when the real excitement begins.
Yeah man I bet that would tighten yer sphincter real quick,,lol
 
  #7  
Old 05-26-2011, 02:41 PM
Kenny94945's Avatar
Kenny94945
Kenny94945 is offline
Stellar HDF Member
Join Date: May 2007
Location: USA
Posts: 2,935
Received 331 Likes on 289 Posts
Default

Some sportsters have ground clearance/ lean angle issues.

That limits ones speed.

The article is good info.
 
  #8  
Old 05-26-2011, 02:41 PM
Osco's Avatar
Osco
Osco is offline
Account Deactivated
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Central Florida
Posts: 1,757
Likes: 0
Received 8 Likes on 4 Posts
Default

As for bumps lifting the tire Inna curve,,
Well all I can say Is,"If ya don't know the curve real well slow the hell down",,,lol
 
  #9  
Old 05-26-2011, 02:50 PM
Osco's Avatar
Osco
Osco is offline
Account Deactivated
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Central Florida
Posts: 1,757
Likes: 0
Received 8 Likes on 4 Posts
Cool

I was Mid turn once and heeled way over, smooth road surface.
The front tire slipped out about 3 or 4 inches, I did nothing,,
the tire dug right back In an I gassed It.
I had the asphalt to the outside for power and I was fine.
I made the Loop two more times right back into that corner,,
The tire never did It again..
The bike Is almost sorted,,,
Next Is better tires.
 
  #10  
Old 05-26-2011, 02:54 PM
swordy's Avatar
swordy
swordy is offline
Big Kahuna HDF Member
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: WIMBORNE,DORSET, GREATBRITAIN
Posts: 25,718
Received 41 Likes on 29 Posts
Talking

Originally Posted by RacingJake
That's the way to do it !!

The fun part is when you come up on water flowing across the road in a tight bend or a bunch of sand that's when the real excitement begins.
i find fresh cow **** has the same effect
 


Quick Reply: So you want your sportster to handle better in the twisties?



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:13 PM.