DYNOJET: Power Vision Headache
#21
04-19-2018, 12:03 PM
Road Warrior
FYI re tuning
what I did was let autotune do its thing while trying desperately hard to get as many cells as possible with 99 (at least 15) hits -but- I took a log at the same time (remember the button at the bottom of the hits screen)
Then I compared what autotune though the answer should be vs what putting it through MLV with some filters thought it should be. Any cells with 10 or less hits could be a bit off when compared to the overall smoothness of the VE table as a whole.
ADD: Unlike the super tuner instructions, I ran a few 80% and 100% throttle runs but only one at a time with some gentle riding in-between. Typically catching 20-30 hits in those columns before ending the autotune session.
what I did was let autotune do its thing while trying desperately hard to get as many cells as possible with 99 (at least 15) hits -but- I took a log at the same time (remember the button at the bottom of the hits screen)
Then I compared what autotune though the answer should be vs what putting it through MLV with some filters thought it should be. Any cells with 10 or less hits could be a bit off when compared to the overall smoothness of the VE table as a whole.
ADD: Unlike the super tuner instructions, I ran a few 80% and 100% throttle runs but only one at a time with some gentle riding in-between. Typically catching 20-30 hits in those columns before ending the autotune session.
Last edited by Gordon61; 04-19-2018 at 12:09 PM. Reason: Added
#23
04-21-2018, 03:52 AM
Road Warrior
So a couple of things popped out for me (and please remember that I am just a DIY type like yourself, there are some very good Pros in here that may be able to help further)
I hope that helps
- Age and accuracy is something the Pros may be able to comment on if relevant but both O2 sensors seem to be switching fine.
- If you put the log in MLV and try to build a VE table from the results, it looks as if there is a lot of data. However, if you apply the Transients filter a LOT of it disappears/is discounted.
I think you maybe need to be smoother and more deliberate when collecting autotune data. I collect purposeful data rather than just riding around, if you get what I mean. I hold the throttle at a set position from 1500 (or as low as it is happy) up through the revs - that would populate a whole column and 4 or 5 times for each position gets you some good data. (note: column in a TPS VE table or diagonal in a MAP VE table - i'd have to look up what an 09 Ultra map looks like)
- In general, the tables don't actually seem to be too far out (but you need more/better data)
- Oh, and there is a touch of knock down towards the lugging area but that may go away when you run normally rather than in autotune mode - something to check out later.
I hope that helps
Last edited by Gordon61; 04-21-2018 at 03:53 AM. Reason: Tidied
#24
04-21-2018, 08:31 AM
That's encouraging news. That log file was done while riding in traffic so I'll have to find a stretch of highway were I can do different throttle setting runs.
Do you think the MAP:L and VE:+ errors were from auto tuning. When I noticed the VE:+ I did roll on the throttle easier (on previous auto tune runs). The one big mystery for me is the MAP:L any ideas as to what causes that and is it like a carbureted vehicle where a low manifold vacuum is a bad thing (on a stock motor).
Once again, thanks for your help,
Steve
Do you think the MAP:L and VE:+ errors were from auto tuning. When I noticed the VE:+ I did roll on the throttle easier (on previous auto tune runs). The one big mystery for me is the MAP:L any ideas as to what causes that and is it like a carbureted vehicle where a low manifold vacuum is a bad thing (on a stock motor).
Once again, thanks for your help,
Steve
#25
04-21-2018, 09:03 AM
Road Warrior
The VE+ is simply that the VE values are changing too quickly for the closed-loop or more significantly, the auto tune process to keep up. Nothing to worry about, just the way it works - any error conditions on the display is simply the autotune process is not collecting data because of whatever.
The MAP L error is simply that the current MAP reading is lower than the autotune threshold, so no data is considered during that time. Thing is, on a heavy overrun the EFI can cut the fuel ...so there is no point looking at O2 readings and calculating anything.
if you look at the default autotune settings, they basically tell you when the autotune process will take and consider data ...or when it pops up a temporary error (think of them as conditions, rather than errors)
The MAP L error is simply that the current MAP reading is lower than the autotune threshold, so no data is considered during that time. Thing is, on a heavy overrun the EFI can cut the fuel ...so there is no point looking at O2 readings and calculating anything.
if you look at the default autotune settings, they basically tell you when the autotune process will take and consider data ...or when it pops up a temporary error (think of them as conditions, rather than errors)
#26
04-21-2018, 12:58 PM
#27
04-21-2018, 01:26 PM
Road Warrior
you said you had just put a stage 1 air filter on it
If the previous one was the fully stock, fully enclosed filter element you couldn't get your fingers into, then you may want to concentrate an autotune at higher throttle positions and let the bike run up to 5000 or so to see if there is much change...
The easiest way to do that is to get some red cells across the rev range over towards the right hand side of the hits screen - then - starting on the hits screen, click through the different modes until you see the LCORF and LCORR screens which show you the plus or minus changes in learned cells ...0, 1, 2, 3's are pretty much no change ...8 and above is telling you it probably needs tuned so put some decent effort into some autotuning.
Have a look
If the previous one was the fully stock, fully enclosed filter element you couldn't get your fingers into, then you may want to concentrate an autotune at higher throttle positions and let the bike run up to 5000 or so to see if there is much change...
The easiest way to do that is to get some red cells across the rev range over towards the right hand side of the hits screen - then - starting on the hits screen, click through the different modes until you see the LCORF and LCORR screens which show you the plus or minus changes in learned cells ...0, 1, 2, 3's are pretty much no change ...8 and above is telling you it probably needs tuned so put some decent effort into some autotuning.
Have a look
#28
04-21-2018, 01:58 PM
#29
06-01-2018, 02:17 PM
Done right the first time?
Not some dyno tuners I’ve used in the last few years.
Paradise Harley in Tigard Oregon was the latest epic fail. 4 hours for a poor tune that couldn’t compare to Fuel Moto one I rolled into dealership with.
#30
06-02-2018, 10:23 AM
Stellar HDF Member
Please don’t paint all tuners with a wide brush, it doesn’t look good amongst all the thousand and thousands of excellently dyno-tunes bikes out there.
Advice? Find a better doctor and you will be much happier.
Not all doctors are quacks you see.
Bob