Power Vision Headache
 

The bike when I bought it - 2009 Ultra Classic, Screamin Eagle fatshotz, original air cleaner, original HD map in ECM.

I installed a Power Vision last year and did an auto tune with a stage 1 map... no problems (ran slightly rich - slight soot on end of exhaust)

Rode the bike like this for 8000 miles

Over this past winter I have installed an S&S Stealth Air Cleaner.

I have run Auto tune again (1/2 hour ride) and very few cells turn Red

Installed original HD map and very few cells turn Red

Checked O2 sensors with Power Vision:

Stone cold - 5.10 volts Front and back

After warm up: Front toggles between 1.8 and 1.2 Volts, Rear 1.2 and .07

After a 20 min. ride I noticed the O2 Sensors stopped toggling up and down.

The temperatures here have been between 45*F and 55*F

Bottom line...I can't get the cells to populate

Could it be too cold to use the Narrow Band O2 sensors to Auto tune?

Thanks,
Steve

With help from other members here I have checked a few more things,

While running auto tune I get the following errors NBF:0, NBR:0, VE:+ and MAP:L

I also have/had a U1016 Loss of ICM/ECM Serial Data Instruments code (I've reset it and ran the bike for 3-4 minutes and it didn't come back. I'll check it again after a ride). When I'm checking for codes the T (tachometer) show nothing except for "no rsp". Is that correct or should there be something else. It is a Ultra Classic with a tach.

I noticed:
1) auto tune would populate the cells for a few minutes and then stop (lots of hits but no turning red)
2) looking at a log file I see erratic MAP kpa's lowest was 12.99

So what I've found on this site is the problem could be corrosion somewhere (i.e. fuses, connectors), could be a rubber hose with a crack. Any other ideas out there

Another idea I had (because the bike runs fine when not in auto tune) is to do a data log run when not in auto tune and see what the MAP kpa's are then. Does anyone know if the signals to and from the ECM, as far as the MAP sensor goes, are different when in or out of auto tune.

would the U1016 Loss of ICM/ECM Serial Data Instruments code have anything to do with the MAP sensor?

I also forgot to mention the bike only has 32,000 miles on it

P.S. it's raining today so no ridin'

Based on the bike being stock/stage 1, very few autotune should be necessary to get the bike dialed in.
When you’ve done autotunes, afterwards you complete the procedure by loading the tuned calibration into the bike and are NOT still running the autotune calibration that is very different from the tuned calibration...the bike will run lean everywhere.
Bob

Hi Bob, thanks for your quick reply,

I do save the autotune tune and then install it before the next autotune run.

The problem is that it won't populate the cells.

MAP:L is the map sensor reads too low a manifold pressure and VE:+ indicates conditions are changing too rapidly or moving between VE table cells

I will upload a log file as soon as I can get out for a ride

Steve

Steve,
You may want to replace the o2 sensors as they are almost 10years old and are regular maintenance items.
ALSO
If the AFR is either too rich or too lean for the o2s to get readings you will not populate the cells effectively.
SO
You may want to look into taking your bike to a qualified, experienced tuner who will use PV and get it diagnosed and properly dialed in.
Bob

Yea, I was wondering about the AFR's. The tune that I have in there is a Stage 1 with slip-ons map so it should be relatively close.

As for the O2 sensors or the MAP sensor they may be going bad but I don't want to spend money until someone looks at my data log file and confirms I need new ones.

Keep in mind O2 sensors are like spark plugs, they wear out, gear fouled, and sometimes just fail. Since they are old there is really no good reason not to replace them other than you are convinced they are working fine from the logs.
Plot the o2 sensors in the log and lock for the up/down switching from the sensors.
Bob

When you're setting up an auto tune run make sure the green screen is set in the correct mode. I think there's two or three modes for that screen and only one will show the populated cells. You'll know if you're on the right one because while idling you'll see the cells flash as it moves from one cell to another.

But the mode setting won't change the auto tune results, in other words the auto tune will still work regardless which mode it's set to. Just you may not see the filled cells.

Well, well, well... not sure what I changed but I just went out and got almost all the cells red.

While I was trying to fiqure out what was the problem I have learned more about FI and sensors. I tried out the MegaLogViewerHD and noticed the front O2 sensor is only putting out about two thirds the voltage of the rear O2 sensor. Maybe that's normal I haven't researched that yet. I think I will take FLTRI17 Bob's advice and change the front sensor, maybe both.
I was still getting the VE:+ and MAP:L errors though. Anybody have any ideas about those issues (not really worried about the VE:+ error too much)

This all leads to another big question... if all my AFR's in the map I'm going to use are all richer than 14.0:1 as far as I can tell it won't ever run in closed loop. If so I really don't need to install new O2 sensor. Am I right or wrong.

Thanks again to all that have helped so far,

Steve

you mention that you aren't bothered about VE:+ messages so maybe you have seen this before

http://www.powercommander.com/downlo...8100016.08.pdf

but page 4-24 says...The Default Autotune settings are listed on page 4-34

The sensor voltages should go up and down all of the time or something is wrong ...which is why folks were asking to see a log file to help you out (or at least tell us what the O2 voltages are over, say, 20 lines of a log)

To get the AFR you desire, whatever that may be, is dependent upon your VE tables being tuned - no working sensors, no autotune, no tuned VE tables.