Hi everyone, I recently bought a 2011 Ultra Classic Electra Glide in Two Tone Root Beer. I am looking into changing the exhaust. I was told by a Harley mechanic that I would need to change the header pipes as well as the mufflers if I wanted to change exhaust. Additionally, I was told a tune on a Thunder Max was mandatory in order for the bike to run right. Does this have to do anything to do with the location of the O2 sensors? Ultimately, with mufflers, new header pipes, the Thunder Max, and a tune, it would all cost about $2000. Any help would be appreciated.

 

You can put mufflers on it without doing anything else. However, the exhaust has cats in the headpipe so it depends on what you are trying to do if you will be happy or not.

 

You can put slip on mufflers on, take the head pipe thats on the bike now, cut out the cat and have it re-welded and put it back on, all of this you can do without a fuel management system. If you go any further (a/c kit) you need one. Or if you got the loot, you can buy a complete stage 1 system and be done with it for a while. If you just do mufflers and take the cat out of the headpipe (cheap) you will not need to mess with the o2 sensors, they are above the cat, or as stated above you can just do slip on mufflers (300 and up) I scored a 4in set of Klockwerks for 3 bones, dunno how they are gonna sound, I will find out when i get out of the sandbox in Apr. Hope my rambling helped you out some. Congrats on your new ride and OH Yeah, welcome to the forum. If you hang around enough, you will learn a WEALTH of infomation and how to's. Learn to use the search function, it is very usefull when you have questions. I GUARANTEE that someone here has experienced it or heard of it. Good luck, happy holidays and keep the shiney side up.

 

Mr. Root Beer,

Yes, you have a lot to think about. But that's a big part of the recreation and fun. You essentially asked what time it was, but I admit my reply may equate to building you a watch. So I apologize up front. But I am hoping that in some way, it may help you understand the issues and give you a better handle on your options regarding which way to go.

HD maps the fuel systems on the new bikes to comply with EPA emission requirements. This results in a "lean" condition, or a high air-to-fuel ratio. Add to this a catalytic converter in the header pipes on the right side to further burn-up pollutants before they make it to the mufflers and out the end, and you have a really big heat generator. A lean engine will generally run hotter than a more richly fed engine. And, for the cat to do it's work in the header pipe, it has to heat up really hot. So the overall result is really hot temps from your engine compartment in the summer, sometimes quite uncomfortable for both driver and rider. This is not a good situation for stop and go traffic on a 90+ degree day. There is a better way.

Aside from the temp considerations, there are also slight performance improvements that can be achieved by increasing air flow and simultaneously increasing fuel volume in the HD engine. When you add your aftermarket higher volume air cleaner, your new or modified stock header with unrestricted air flow, and new tunable or custom baffled mufflers stuck on the end of the header pipes, your bikes electronic control module (ECM) will still not allow for a richer fuel mixture, with the result being your bike will run even leaner, a condition that can and has caused engine damage when prolonged. Some pay for the "Stage I" ECM flash at the dealership, but this flash is really not doing the best job to accommodate the new hardware either. The Stage I will not solve the lean condition as many seem to think. It may improve it ever so slightly, but that's all it will do.

So to properly manage your fuel mixture with all this additional air flow, you need a fuel management solution. There are many ways to accomplish this. You can purchase HD branded race and street tuners, which in conjunction with a good dyno tune, you should come out the other end satisfied. The race and street tuners actually write a new fuel map to the ECM, and it will then control fuel mixtures based on this new map, within the constraints of the narrow-band O2 sensors that come stock on your header pipe. Other solutions, just as viable and just a good, are offered by the folks at Power Commander, Vance & Hines (fuelpak), Thundermax, etc., etc. etc. Some of the non-harley products do nothing to the native programming of the ECM, they just work in conjunction with the ECM to create the proper tuning condition for your engine. Other aftermarket systems can write instructions to the ECM directly. So it's really up to you which way you go on this. Both approaches are working well on thousands of bikes. But you will need help to ensure that what you decide to use will actually work properly. There are lots of horror stories out there regarding tuning mismatches with new hardware, so approach this deliberately yet gingerly. Otherwise, it can cost you some big bucks.

So read around on the forum, call and talk to some folks, and soon you will probably have a good understanding of the direction you want to go and can then make an informed decision. I would also suggest that you purchase the tools needed for this job and do it yourself. You don't need the HD shop doing these mods for you. Get a shop manual and do it like a pro!

And always consider our forum sponsors, these guys and their products are proven and they are all willing to walk you through the process.

Good luck with your choices!

 

the power duals, monster ovals, fuel pak and se breather make it bark and bite to my satisfaction

 

Perfect color BTW!!!

 

I think you can get away with Slip-ons and maybe buying a 2009 head pipe on Ebay (about $100) then put in the A/C and that should hold you and give you alot of power and Torque. You may need a remap but the power is not that much after the A/C and Slip-ons? I am in the same area as you with mine. I think if I can get a good buy on the head pipe I may do that but I am not sure if I need it? Sound and a few HP and TQ would be fine and more then you need for a TOURER !

 

Welcome and Congrats.

I'd suggest you leave your bike pretty much as is until you get a few thousand miles on it and establish a "baseline" as to it's performance.
You also have to think about preserving your warranty - and if the dealer says that their after sale performance modifications will preserve your warranty GET IT IN WRITING!!!

For most of us, slip on pipes and a hi flow air cleaner are all we need for mods. I have many motorcycles and have had 5 Harleys, my 2009 Classic brought me into the modern world of EFI.

I don't expect my Harley to be a hot rod. It will cost the equivalent of 2 Kawasaki ZXwhatevers in modifications to go 1/2 as fast.

I tend to leave my bikes at a "Stage 1" state of tune. reasonable results with good mileage and reliability.

You do have the catalytic converter to think about- I would suggest having it cut out, or replace the header pipe.

air cleaner: I find the Ness Big Sucker to be a nice tidy fit, and if you get the one with the chrome backing plate ( ebay $115 shipped from easternpc) it is easier to wipe off than the black or gray and looks better too. The ness has a cleanable oiled air filter media. The harley has a washable media, but not oiled.

pipes: not sure what you like? go to bike nights see what other guys have and what you like and don't like.
I use supertrapp slip ons, have used on a few of my bikes.

tuning- well there are systems out there that some guys like and the next guy will post 1000 times about problems.
I use nightrider.com XIEDS. cost you probably $125 and all done.
they "fool" your ECU into putting out a little richer mixture, plug and play. instantly removable.

I did a 1500 mile baseline with my bike ( it already had 7000 miles but was bone stock) and established that it had a pinging problem at a certain rpm range under load.
put on my pipes, rode 1000 miles, noted slight gain, put on the air cleaner kit and noted more improvements, then put on the XIEDS which solved the pinging problem noted earlier.
That's probably all I will do to the bike. It runs well, sounds fine and should be reliable for many years.

Mike

 

Glad to read this, thinking about the exact same set-up on my '10 Ultra. Still stock, but I was looking at the SuperTrapp slip-ons, SE AC, Stage 1 download, and XIED's to help cool it with a righer mixture.

Glad to hear you like it. Did you do the Stage 1 download, or you still running stock map?

 

Take a look at the V&H system I have. Dresser duals and Monster Rounds. Video link below.