Back before typewriters....well, personal computers at least, my first Harley had a carb. When I got what we called "drag pipes", I re-jetted. End of acceleration lag.

On my last bike, Honda VTX1800, I installed an EFI mod system, which was a piggy back system and you could adjust three "pots" and your idle...just like a carb.

I just bought my new-to-me 2009 Night Train, and will be changing things and don't want to run to the dealer every time to get a new map or dyno tune. I also don't want to rely on downloading maps which may or may not fit my set up, so I'm thinking about buying what I believe you youngsters refer to as a flash tuner, the Cobra Fi2000 PowerPro.

Either I can't use the search function very well or there isn't much info on a mod like this in the forums.

Thanks in advance for all feed back, information and advice.

rd

 

I think you'll find this model is NOT a flash tuner.

If you're genuinely interested in a complete tune, go with a full-featured tuning program.

 

Thanks for the input, Pine Tree, and two questions please:

1. What would the Cobra Fi2000 be accurately called? I always referred to my last system as simply a fuel injection modification system.

2. What would be a "full-featured tuning program"? If it involves relying on someone else's suggested map, or a dyno tech getting involved, I really don't think I'm interested, but need enlightening. Plus, I don't want to spend tons of time tinkering with a program trying to get my scooter right. I am fairly computer savvy, but I'm not a programmer and don't want to take "classes" to retune my EFI if I buy a new intake or change pipes.

Since no one else has yet responded concerning the Cobra, what are your thoughts please? I've read several reviews and most are good. Right now my scooter is running fine, but I'm sure it is on the lean side due to the factory settings. Except for some Rhinehart slip ons, everything seems to be a stock set up so I'm pretty sure there have been no remaps, but I'm want to change exhaust soon.

Thanks for your time.

 

I suggest you look at Dynojet PowerVision or TTS Mastertune. They are both full featured flash tuners with self tuning capability.

Another suggestion is to talk to Fuel Moto. They deal with various tuning devices and will take the time to go through the options with you.

http://www.fuelmotousa.com/

They are a forum sponsor and provide superior customer service. They have guided many here through the process of selecting a tuner.

 

I guess your label is as good as any. Many of these systems are downstream of the ECM and simply modify the fuel pulse. And most of those only add fuel.

The full-featured systems allow access to most of the ECM's performance tables and that's what's needed to properly tune a motor.

The basis for all tunes is getting the VE's set correctly for each cylinder. Until that's done, none of the other tables will be accurate. And some of the tables have a couple hundred cells to properly populate.

While it sounds daunting, one can either find a competent tuner or learn the system themselves. I chose the second route...spent some time learning the system and then applying the knowledge to tuning myself. While I don't have a dyno machine, I can street-tune a stock bike in an afternoon.

The benefit of learning the system yourself is (1) you'll have the system for the life of the bike, (2) you'll be able to fine-tune on your own with respect to any mods you might do in the future, and (3) the satisfaction of setting up your bike the way YOU want it set up.


I have looked at the Cobra and similar units. But because I can tune bikes using a full-featured tuning program, I cannot realistically recommend such a system. Because the Cobra and like systems don't address the VE or timing requirement, IMHO, it's simply not worth the money.

Even a completely stock bike with no mods will normally benefit significantly from a proper tune. While the Cobra and similar system sound very good on paper, I just can't see spending money on a system that provides, IMHO, only a 10% tune. And even that 10% may not be what your bike needs.

Hope that helps and good luck!!

 

There are a wide range of products on the market that will get the job done, the biggest consideration is using a product within its intended design and working within its limitations for the modifications you have done to your bike. There is a broad range of specific features as well as a wide range of pricing. Product wise there are basic piggyback options as low as $199.00, on the opposite end of the spectrum are complete ECM/control system replacements that run as much as $900.00 or more, ECM flash tuners are in the middle of the mix price wise and are generally considered the most flexible & comprehensive tuning platforms on the market, along with the best value for dollars spent. Again, it really depends on your tuning requirements.

The best advice we can give is to choose the product you or your tuner feels most comfortable using, choosing the product that best fits your current and future needs, using the product you can get the best support on, and keeping an open mind with a willingness to learn.

 

Coming from a similar setup as you, a Honda with a Carb, then a Suzuki with EFI and a 3 pot tuner. The newer HDs with EFI and most importantly O2 sensor that feedback to the EFI during Idle/cruising, well those change the options somewhat.

I think this thread helped me understand the options best:
https://www.hdforums.com/forum/ignit...uning-etc.html

 

Thanks to all for the replies. Looks like I have some more research to do.

 

If you want to go cheaper, then the Super Chips Vigilante can't be beat. I have about 500 miles on mine and the bike runs great. Can be had with the forum discount with shipping for $162.00. At checkout just use the code HDFORUMS. The unit stores the stock settings just in case you want to return to stock.

 

Fuel Moto is a long time sponsor here and a very reputable supplier with outstanding support. Some of Jamies points is to decide what level of upgrades you plan on doing and buy a tuner 1 time to accommodate your future upgrades. For a Stage 1 upgrade such as exhaust and A/F a Flash Tuner will be a simple install value with good results. Tuner will be $200-$300 range and less then an hour install. Nothing is left "hanging" on the bike. Superchips Vigilante, V&H Fuel Pak Fp3 or the Fuel Moto Microtuner, all good.