Originally Posted by Cosmic Razorback

Take it to the bank folks, I’ve only been wrong once and that was a long, long, long time ago I think?

No I not getting paid to spread rumors unfortunately. Just my opinion for what it’s worth, and to start a conversation.

So, let’s back up 7 years to 2016. The Cosmic Razorback was sporting a new 2016 Limited in Cosmic Blue Pearl. Cosmic Baby!

The 103 was a great motor and I was a happy guy after getting my first pair of Pro-Action shocks on that sweet baby. I went straight up to the factory and had DJ professionally install them.

All the time people were adding cams and exhaust, the 110ci was still the motor in the CVO models and some people were also installing the 120 from the MoCo.

What I noticed was a lot of other models, especially softails getting the 110 that were NOT CVO models.

Interesting, I thought that the MoCo had a bunch of 110’s laying around and maybe they were just using them to increase sales. Then I convinced myself that this was the future. The 2017 models will all have 110’s and the CVO models will have the 120. Oh yeah, life is going to be good.

I went to sleep one night and woke up in a totally different world the next day upside down on my head. What the heck is a M8?

Damn, could they have not given me a slight clue, or was I totally asleep!

Wow, I am blown away. Yeah, they definitely needed to get rid of some 110’s. Maybe right on that point.

So now we have a Milwaukee 8 in a 107 for most, and a 114 in the CVO models, with somenice paint I may add on the CVO’s.

But no, they still have to mess with me. In 2018 we still had the 107’s, but the 114’s bled over to several models, and the CVO’s got a 117. I was scared to think about the 2019 models at that point.

Here is where my prediction comes in. There have been a lot of models getting the 117’s that are not CVO’s. If history repeats itself, we will see all the new touring models in 2024 with a VVT M8 engine. I do not think they will make a lower displacement engine than the 121. Maybe the 121 becomes the standard and the CVO models have a 128 VVT. Yeah, I like that idea.

Then of course we will see the inverted forks, brakes and big screen become standard in order to both sell models and minimize multiple different components. I’m expecting the introduction of the full Limited models with tour packs, and hopefully some really cool CVO paint schemes. At least more than two. Said day when dealerships are repainting new CVO models.

Will the smaller displacement Pan America come out in 2024? I say YES.

Will some current models go bye bye? I say YES.

Will the price of service manuals go up? I say YES. Crazy, right!!!

Will the people over at Indian be suicidal ? I hope not, but it sucks to suck.

Well, there you have it. I would love to hear your thoughts and predictions.

P.S.
The Carolina Girl thinks I am the smartest guy, period. She agrees with all the above and says I nailed it. She does not have a prediction, only a request. If the MoCo is listening, she would like to see the rear end cleaned up with lower profile taillights.

Originally Posted by oldbie

I predict all the Harley bashers will continue to bash, and continue to buy.

Originally Posted by FatboysFatboy96

I understand your enthusiasm about the brand you love so much and I enjoy your enthusiasm as I love motorcycles of all shapes and forms.
However I take exception to your comment about Indian. After owning three Harleys, my last being an 18 RoadGlide Limited I can definitely say that my Indian Pursuit performs better in stock form than the equivalent Harley for 10 grand less. I can go on about the changes I have had to make to my Harleys to make it comfortable and perform like I thought it should but I won’t as you have well documented your personal journeys to make your bike the way you want them. The only area I think my Indian does not come remotely close to in quality and execution is the paint. For the difference in price I think I can have it painted to match the quality of the Harley and have a few bucks left over.

Other then that I am a fan of innovation and competition to motivate manufacturers to produce products that increasingly get better and better.
Since we are relatively close to each other I hope to randomly meet you and Carolina Girl one day.

Originally Posted by Mofo67

Cosmic - interesting perspective….

However I agree with most of what you are sharing. My point of difference is on the ‘24 touring models. I think they will get the new body panels, larger screen and a VVT motor, but not the inverted forks.
HD will keep the inverted forks and “special paint” on the CVOs as a point of differentiation. On motor displacement who knows. Wouldn’t be surprised if HD increased the displacement on the CVO, but I’m thinking smaller displacement for the non CVO touring models. Interesting I haven’t seen anything about EPA or CARB filings from MY24. Dealers started ordering MY24 bikes late September and had the “dealer meeting” in October.
Having owned and enjoyed 4 new CVOs since 2017, HD has got to do something to make the CVOs different (special) again. Maybe the possibility of electronically controlled suspension like the Indian Elite models? Having test road the Indian bikes, overall nice set ups, I couldn’t believe some of the technology compared to HD.
HD recently told dealers they are not limiting the number of 23 CVO RG/SG that will be available and showrooms are starting to fill up. To your point about dealers repainting new CVOs, that’s kinda sad and a reflection of HDs lack of focus on their flagship bike. Lastly HD has also shared they are increasing production by 20% for MY24. With interest rates and the additional add-ones that HD has, they must be confident that the ‘24s will be a “must have”.

Originally Posted by Keithhu

Here's my prediction: we'll all find out when we find out.

Originally Posted by FLSTFI Dave

My thoughts are the CVO will remain with the 121. They will add at least one more model CVO with that motor.

The ST's, will get the 121. The touring ST's will get the new suspension and maybe even the new body work.

The ST's will get more color choices.

The other touring bikes will still have M8's non VVT, same with soft tails.

HD needs to move the ST farther from the regular touring, about 1/2 between touring and CVO