The owner is pathetic. He asked for my info to run a credit check and my credit card info to “hold a bike if I was approved”. I wasn’t approved for the rate he offered so he used another company and said good news you are approved. The rate was terrible! The kicker is....

He charged my card for $1000! Then when I said I’m not interested he said he would give me a credit for $1000 good for 6 months toward the purchase of a bike. What! Refused to give me a refund. Rude as HELL! I filed a transaction dispute with my credit card company. Paid an attorney to send a letter of intent warning him not to contest the dispute or I’d see him in court where he would also be paying the legal fees. So he sent us a nasty letter in response which ended it. My feeling is that he does this regularly and if people don’t follow through like I did he either sells a bike or gets $1000. Unreal! If you heard the guy, Lynt Hurdman, on the phone you can tell he’s done this before. Crook!

 

 

Not sure about what to do.
My switch pack on the clutch side went bad like so many of other M8 bikes. While the bike was in for the warranty work I had them do the regular schedule 5K maintenance. Between work and traveling I didn't have time to do it myself. On the ride home the rear brake seemed funny. Investigating it revealed that the master cylinder cap was loose. It was actually just sitting on top and the screws were not engaged. The water pump cover was also hanging loose. I fixed the issue and the only person that I mentioned it to was a salesman there. He's been a friend for 20 some years. Advance another 5K miles and I take the bike in for the recall on the clutch actuator. When I went to pick up my bike I almost started it before checking the clutch lever. When I squeezed it. It went to the bar without resistance. I looked at the service writer and he said that he would get it taken care of. When I checked the paperwork it said that they had put 3 miles on it. I am guessing that was for a test ride. That was not possible. While I was waiting another guy pulled in and his clutch was not working. He had just got it back from the recall repair. He left and that was the last time the clutch worked. He had to shut the bike off to stop it when he pulled back in.
I checked my invoice and the work on my bike was supposedly done by two different techs.

 

 

 

Thought I had been getting good service since I got bike in Late 2014. Generally took it to dealership for regular services every 2.5K or when getting something added.
In October had a 2.5k service, and while in service they broke part of the primary cover where the inspection plate screw goes in. Not the thread, but a chunk came out. They were able to get to seal with a gasket and longer screw. Had to spent over $300 on a new primary cover, and when it came in, had to pay 1/2 hr labor to have it installed. Also, had a little oil leak in area near front of engine. HOG Director thought it might be coming from air clean, but they said it was from push rod tubes. Ordered a new set of the Drag Specialist black tubes that the dealership had installed on bike 3+ years ago, and close to 25,000 miles on them. Only $89.95. Leak was minor, so planned to do it with the upcoming 30K service on bike.

Service happened on 12/22 - Total $1072.17
30K was just under $500
Repair Oil Leak was $420 for 4 hours labor at $105/hr, $26.15 for Rocker Box Gasket, and $4.28 for Tappen Gasket
Bought two other Rocker box gasket kits, since the $26.15 was sale price with regular over $65..
Finally, the found the bushing on foot brake sticking a little, so had it replaced. Bushing was a little over $20, and 1/2 hour labor for $52.50.

If everything was done right, would have been ok with it, but then things went worse.

Discovered the leak was actually worse after the had done the repair. It had a little leak on what seemed to be one of the front tubes, now all 4 tubes were having a thin coating of oil.
Took it back in on 12/29, and they said they would check it out, and try to get it fixed for the year end ride the next day.
Expecting it to be some kind of minor resetting of seals/o-rings or something. Had only had 2 minor issues with past repairs, and both of those were resolved with no cost and very quickly.
Finally, got bike back, but was hit with a $420 bill for 4 hours of labor, and had also provided one of the Rocker Box Gasket kits as well? But thought bike was fixed, and ride was next day.

Leak wasn't showing up the next day, but it did become obvious that it was again leaking after a ride on 1/13. The front tubes again had film of oil. Back ones seemed fine.

Dealership seems to think it is perfectly fine to recharge for the same repair, since the tubes were non-harley, blaming the seals/o-rings. Supposedly on the second repair, the replaced some things with harley parts, so that was suppose to fix it, but didn't. No offer to fix problem. Did eventually get an email from service if I wanted to schedule a 3rd service to have it done again, but no mention on cost, so could only assume it would be another $450 service with no customer service.

Finally took the advise I'd been given for years and go with a non-HDG tech. Contacted the guy, and he came to my house to check out the bike that had been just sitting since 1/13. Looked at it, and said, he would be able to fix it. Had already ordered a new set of the Drag Specialist tubes, since couldn't find the seals kit for it. Also, ordered a James rocker box kit since many of the 2 dozen videos I had since watched recommended them. Didn't seem to have been a problem, but wanted to get it done right.

Tech came by on 1/26, and was able to fix the bike in about 3 hours. Said, it would normally have been more like 2, but wanted to take extra time to make sure everything was a 100% right. Didn't want to maybe overlook something that caused the other 2 failures.. He took it on a nice long test ride, and no leak. Did note some issues with the steering being a little loose, but that was shown as being checked and adjusted in the 30K?? Didn't have the stuff to fix it, but recommended it.

So, Dealership attempted to fix leak twice and failed twice and billed twice. Total about $900 plus the $89.95 for Tubes.
Other tech fixed the problem for $250 for the labor in 3 hours not 2 x 4 hours, plus $89.95 for tubes and $70 for James Rockerbox Gaskets.
Did a 70 mile rider next day, and again. Absolutely no sign of any leak.

Now it gets worse. Had meet with manager on 1/24 to see if things would be worked out. Nothing. His position was the worked on it for 4 hours on 12/29, and expected to be paid for the time. Didn't matter that they were doing a fix to a job from the following week, and didn't matter that it didn't fix the problem. So, no positive results. Had meet to try to work it out as suggested by our Directory, Lady's of Harley, and Road Captain. Two of them had actually, recommended the tech that I had fix the bike though. Told the director how the meeting went, and that nothing had come of it, but things appeared to be ok other than that. Had been selected as 2018 Officer of the year, and was scheduled to get the award at our 2019 Welcome party on 1/26.

On the morning of 1/26 got an email from Manager that I was kicked out of the HOG as an Officer and out of the Chapter since I was not supporting the dealership? The director had shared what I said, and the manager had done the 180. So, didn't go to the party, hear they did mention the award, and said some nice things. Again, just the manager, don't think anyone else had any input.

Have talked with HOGAP, which Guam falls under, and have also contacted a US Regional Rep I've talked with in past. HOGAP has said some interesting things, but ends with it is up to the dealership?? Seems they should want to resolve issues??

In 2 weeks, I had spent $1072.17 and $420, plus another $200 in HDG gift certificates for the party?? But I don't support the dealership??
So, as of now. I strongly do not recommend the dealership, and will let the whole biker community of Guam know about it.
Love HD bikes, HOG members, and other officers. It is this one manager that has turned a very positive experience to a negative one..
Was selected member of the year in 2015.
Went to the HOG convention in Bali in Nov 2015 with 11 others.
Only two of use were still around since then, with most going back to the mainland.
Now only 1 remains. Became the Historian, and then the membership officer until 1/26.
So, will have to see how kicking the 2018 Officer out of the year goes by with the community.
Thanks for your time... Ride Safe.

 

 

I get that I'm in California and you're in Arizona but is there no law there requiring that you sign an initial estimate when you drop it off? I was a service writer, (automotive), and we HAD to get a signature on an estimate when the vehicle was dropped off. If it was a standard service or standard service item we would give an estimate and get a signature. If it was something weird we'd quote an hour diagnostic time and get a signature knowing we'd have to call with a parts and labor update. In either case, IF more money was required we'd have to call the customer, log the number called, the time and date we called and who we spoke with to authorize further work. We'd also have to give an actual monetary update down to the penny, for additional work that was approved.

 

I want share an experience that my friend and I had during a deal to buy a 2019 Ultra Limited. I do not want to state the dealership name as we have had a great relationship until now. I just want to get your feedback as a sanity check. This is a bit of a long story but if you read all the way through, it gets a little crazy.

Let me start by sayin in less than 2 years I have purchased two new bikes and am also responsible for bringing in an additional 6 sales to a dealership in Virginia; all of these were new bike sales. You can probably imagine I know the owner, sales mangers, parts guys, service guys, etc..My buddy was interested in a 2019 Ultra Limited so I stopped in and started talking to the same sales guy I used for all but 2 of the 8 purchases - he was not there when I bought my two bikes. I explained my friend was interested and we immediately initiated the same protocol we always had. I knew where my friend wanted to be on the out the door number, knew what he was looking for his trade, and had a pretty good idea of what he wanted the sales price of the new bike to be. I shared all of this information with the sales guy and then spoke directly with the sales manager. He basically said that he would offer him about $1,000 over retail for his trade but he was not willing to drop the MSRP. I said well that is not even close to what we were looking for and he said that was the best he could. No hard feelings at all, we continued chatting and shortly after making my rounds, I left.

I then called another dealership in Maryland that I purchased another bike from years ago. The ownership there had changed twice since I bought my bike there and none of the same staff were there - in other words, I had no relationship with anyone there at all. I called and spoke to the Sales Manager and we started talking numbers over the phone. He was pretty close to what we wanted and I said I would give it some thought.

A couple of days later I stopped in the Virginia dealership to schedule a service appointment for my bike and the Sales Manager called me over to talk about the deal again. He quickly looked at the numbers again and basically came to the same conclusion. He did say that maybe he put a few hundred more dollars into the trade if he saw the bike but that's the best he could do. I told him it would not be worth it for my friend to bring in his bike if that is all he could do because we were still too far apart. I told him that we were working on another deal for the exact same bike and even gave him the name of the dealership. He asked me to give him a call before my buddy pulls the trigger and he would look it over one last time. I told him I would absolutely give him a call before making a move. One thing to keep in mind is that it is winter here in Virginia and we were now approaching the last few days of January - sales were very slow according to my sales guy and other people in the dealership that I know.

I had a few conversations with my buddy about what the dealership in Maryland was offering and although we were close, he still wanted the out the door number to be lower. I called the Sales Manager at the Maryland dealership and he basically met the out the door price. I told him I would give it some consideration and get back to him. He was eager to make the sale for the same reason as the dealership in Virginia - cold weather and slumping sales this time of year.

I contacted my sales guy at the Virginia dealership again because I promised him I would before we pulled the trigger on anything. Here is where it starts to get crazy. I give him the out the door number from the other dealership and he asks me to hang on while he grabs the Sales Manager. He gets back on the phone and tells me that he cannot discuss the deal with me because I am not the one buying the bike. I said, "What? We have been talking about this deal for two weeks. Why can't you discuss it with me?" He says hang on. Then the owner, with whom I also have a good relationship, gets on the phone. He immediately starts out by saying, "Why are you being a customer on me? We can't discuss this deal with you, we need your buddy in here and we need to see the bike." I told him, "Your Sales Manager said he couldn't even get close to what we were asking for and the only reason I am calling is because I promised him I would before we made a move." "I am here to sell motorcycles but I can't discuss this deal with you - I could get sued. You know I will take care of him. Just get him in here with the bike and let's get it done. I'll even get the bike picked up for him if he wants.", he said. This is total BS since his own Sales Manager and the sales guy had been talking directly to me about this deal for the last two weeks. This is also how I have always handled the previous bikes sales that I brought in. Anyway... So, I called my buddy told him they were coming to pick up the bike he was trading in. He was home and it was not a problem and he told me he could meet me at the dealership in he late afternoon.

They pick up his bike and we both roll into the dealership around 4:00. It was barely below freezing but my buddy wanted to take a short test ride. He and the sales guy get it all together and they go for a test ride. As soon as they roll out the owner freaks out on me. He said, "Why are you price matching me against a different dealership? That's not cool.", I told him, "Because your Sales Manager said the deal was too rich for his blood and he couldn't even get close to what we were asking.". The Sales Manager chimes in and says, "I did tell you that. There is not enough meat left on the bone to make that deal. In fact, I cannot even honor the trade in value that I told you because the bike isn't what you said it is. You said it was an Ultra Classic and it is an Electra Glide." Of course this was completely not true. He was trying to cover his *** because of how much he offered over retail for my buddy's bike when the owner wasn't there. At this point I am starting to get a little heated because he is basically calling me a liar. So then the owner asks me the numbers on the deal we had in place at the Maryland dealership. I told him the numbers and he didn't believe me. He said, "If I call over there and talk to the "Bob" he is going to tell me these are the numbers he gave you? Because we're good friends." This made me even more agitated because now the owner, someone I have a good relationship with and was responsible for eight of his bike sales in the last two years, is calling me a liar. I said, "Please call him, I would love for you to." So he whips out his phone and for the next five minutes fiddles around but never actually calls anyone. He said he was have some technical issues with his cell phone. Of course he never picks up one of the 4 desk phones at the sales tower to call over there. This makes me realize that he knows who the Sales Manager is at the Maryland dealership but they are not "good friends". He then says, he'll do the deal but then launches into a lecture. He said, "Don't take this the wrong way because I do appreciate the business you bring in but we don't make a lot of many on the deals we do for you because you beat us up pretty badly on every deal. I know these guys are your friends but where's your loyalty man?" I said, "Well if the business I bring in is hurting your bottom line, then it sounds to me like you are telling me not to bring in any more business." He said, "No, I started out by telling you not to take it the wrong way. I am going to make the deal. Like I said, I am here to sell bikes." I didn't think about it at the time but what I should have mentioned is all the money they make on not just the bike sale, but parts sales, service business, maintenance business, etc.. that all of these sales generate. This was a bit of a slap in the face to me. He was making me feel bad for bringing it bik sales. "I don't want you to not make a deal you aren't comfortable with. No hard feelings if you don't want to do it. We can roll out and do the deal at the other dealership.", I said. He assured me he wanted to do the deal but was still a bit snarky.

My buddy gets back he is happy with the deal and decides he does want to proceed. He starts all of the required paperwork, credit app, insurance, etc.. We get into the finance office and about five minutes into her speech about extended warranties and paint protection, she starts talking about the interest rate. My buddy qualifies for tier 1, his credit score is around 725. I told the Sales Manager two weeks ago he would qualify for tier 1 and he assured me he would be able to get him a 3.99% interest rate. I tell the finance person, that not only is this not what I was told but I was responsible for eight bike sales in the last two years, and some of those guys had a much lower credit score but still qualified for a better rate. She shot me a look and said, "Really? Eight bike sales?", in a very rude manner. So now this is the third time I have been called a liar. Apparently, while my buddy was doing the insurance, credit app, etc.., earlier, I had stepped away for a bit. Come to find out, before getting to the finance office, no one told him what his interest rate would be and he didn't think to ask. He assumed it was 3.9% because that is the information I passed along to him. So he questioned that and the finance person calls the Sales Manager to the office. As soon as he walks in, she says, "They are questioning the interest rate. He said all his buddies got a better rate on the other eight bike sales he brought in." She looks at him as if she is waiting for him to call BS. He just nods his head and says, "Yeah, so what is the question?". He basically says his credit score doesn't qualify for tier 1. Now, having been involved with so many purchases, I know this is BS. With his credit score, some bank would approve him for way under 5.5%. I also know that dealerships make up for losses in a deal by bumping up the interest rate. In other words, if you are actually approved for 3.9 they will tell you 5.5 to make some money back on the deal. The Sales Manager leaves and I tell my buddy in front of the finance person that they are probably playing a little game with the interest rate.

At that same time, I get a text from the Sales Manager from Maryland and he asks if we signed the paperwork yet. The Maryland dealership is about to close but they want one more sale on the books to close out January. While the finance person is filling out her paperwork I am showing him the text from the other dealership. My buddy makes a comment like, "wow, they really want my business." He then asks the finance person to see if the Sales Manager would knock $500 off the deal since the interest rate is now what we were told. When she comes back she tells us that the owner wants to talk to us but he had already left. So he calls her on her cell phone and she puts him on speaker. He starts yelling, "What's going on guys? Am I to understand that you are still trying work out another deal with the other dealership? Now you're trying renegotiate a deal that you already shook on?" He doesn't even give either of us a chance to respond and says, "This is not how I do business, I don't do business with people who are like that." He then says to the finance person, "Shred the paperwork. Tear it up. Tell "Bob" to push his bike onto the parking lot because I am not delivering it to his house.". He means my buddy's current bike. Keep in mind is now completely dark outside and the temp is hovering somewhere around 20. My buddy says, "This is bullshit, you were the guys who wanted my bike here. You picked it up you should return it." The owner still insisted that finance tear up the paperwork and that his bike be left on the lot and then hangs up. He gave us no chance to explain anything about why he was asking for $500 off or what the text from the other dealership was about.

The finance person is in shock and had no clue what to do. We didn't give her a chance to decide and we got up and headed for the door ranting a little bit about the owner's behavior. The Sales Manager stood there for a few minutes not saying much. The sales guy was upset considering he was going to lose a sale that he had so much effort into. Finally the Sales Manager told him that he would not put his bike on the lot and that he could pick it up the next day. A couple of more minutes go by as we are all in disbelief and the Sales Manager finally says, "You could still sign the deal." We repeated the owner's explicit instructions to finance to rip up the contract. The Sales Manager tells us, "Well, he is not here and I am so if you want to still sign the deal we can do it." Of course the sales guy is trying to persuade him and asking him not to allow the owner's poor behavior to reflect on him. Finally a couple of more minutes go by and my buddy agrees to complete the deal.

Has anyone else been through anything like this?

 

No.

After the business you've personally given them, plus the other business from friends you've brought in, they're gaming you, lying to you, calling you a liar, and essentially threatening you unless your friend pays their price.

I'd walk out and never go back. I'd give my business to the dealer in Maryland from now on.

Harley-Davidson's sales are in the *******, four consecutive years of declines, it's the dead of winter, and he's telling you "MSRP or GTFO."

Yeah, I'd take the second option, but that's just me.