Getting past phobia of turns at higher speeds?
#101
I really want to thank you all. First, for not being dicks to me here (i've seen it before .. and fully expected the flamefest). But mostly for all of the helpful info!
I believe now that my entire problem is that im not countersteering! The entire concept makes no sense to me ... pushing in the wrong direction, etc .. which is why im sure im not doing it, or at least correctly.
As a result im hitting the turn and trying to use my bodyweight to turn the bike, and/or literally turning the bars right/left into the turn. Imagine that, and you can imagine my issue on even the slightest of curves in the road.
I will study up on this, and hit an empty lot for some practice immediately. Any tips for beginning to learn this?
I believe now that my entire problem is that im not countersteering! The entire concept makes no sense to me ... pushing in the wrong direction, etc .. which is why im sure im not doing it, or at least correctly.
As a result im hitting the turn and trying to use my bodyweight to turn the bike, and/or literally turning the bars right/left into the turn. Imagine that, and you can imagine my issue on even the slightest of curves in the road.
I will study up on this, and hit an empty lot for some practice immediately. Any tips for beginning to learn this?
The idea is to consciously counter steer to give you more control than just trying to lean the bike and let it happen.
But here is the important thing. Don't look where you're going. Look where you want to go. This is important.
If you can see around the curve, look around the curve to where you want to end up.
If you think your going a little too fast in a curve and start drifting into the oncoming lane and if there is a car in it, do NOT look at it or you will hit it for sure. Keep your head and eyes pointed to where you want to go, and consciously counter steer, and the bike will go there. If you're focused on the oncoming lane in a curve, you cannot make the curve in your lane. This is called target fixation. This a very weird phenomena, the bike will go where you look.
Target fixation can also be a good thing when you use it to your advantage by looking where you want to go.
This doesn't mean that you can't scan for deer or other hazards, but just don't focus to long other than where you want the bike to go.
I ride about 20 miles on a very curvy road to get to town, and when I was first learning how to counter steer, I was nervous in the curves, and had to pull over now and then to let cars pass me so I wouldn't hold up traffic.
I just practiced looking ahead in my lane and counter steering in the curves, and it wasn't long until I could take those curves at any speed I want.
This was the best advice I got in regards to riding in curves.
Just remember: Head and Eyes, and Counter Steer. and you'll be riding the curves like a pro.
Here is a short clip from Ride Like Pro, Jerry Paladino:
Last edited by Stubby3492; 06-21-2014 at 04:12 AM.
#102
I'm sure you're a badass on the Vespa forum but it seems to me you're the only one trying to "posture". You gave no advice that hasn't already been given by the guys you're insulting. You've been here a month and think you know these guys? Some of them put more miles on in a year than you will in 5 or more. Get a clue
OP - there has been some great advice given and I have nothing further to add other than emphasize that you take the MSF course. It will give you a good platform for your basic skills and help your confidence (which you are lacking). Good luck
#103
I really want to thank you all. First, for not being dicks to me here (i've seen it before .. and fully expected the flamefest). But mostly for all of the helpful info!
I believe now that my entire problem is that im not countersteering! The entire concept makes no sense to me ... pushing in the wrong direction, etc .. which is why im sure im not doing it, or at least correctly.
As a result im hitting the turn and trying to use my bodyweight to turn the bike, and/or literally turning the bars right/left into the turn. Imagine that, and you can imagine my issue on even the slightest of curves in the road.
I will study up on this, and hit an empty lot for some practice immediately. Any tips for beginning to learn this?
I believe now that my entire problem is that im not countersteering! The entire concept makes no sense to me ... pushing in the wrong direction, etc .. which is why im sure im not doing it, or at least correctly.
As a result im hitting the turn and trying to use my bodyweight to turn the bike, and/or literally turning the bars right/left into the turn. Imagine that, and you can imagine my issue on even the slightest of curves in the road.
I will study up on this, and hit an empty lot for some practice immediately. Any tips for beginning to learn this?
Ride safe!
#104
It's just as important to look down at the corner road conditions as it is looking through the turn. In country riding you have to watch for kicked up gravel as your approaching and entering a turn. It is also important to use your head. I'm more likely to take a twisty road faster if I know the road then one I've never been down. Like many have already said, drive within your comfort zone. I always take the curvy routes whenever I have the chance. I've been riding for over 35 years and I still go to an empty parking lot and practice tight U-turns every year. Always remember your greatest piece of safety equipment is what you have between your two ears!
#105
I didn't read the entire thread, so this may be redundant. An old greybeard told me this some 30 years ago, now I'm the greybeard telling you. As long as the tires remain in firm contact with the asphalt, your bike can maintain more curve and speed than you are likely to throw it at. The only things that can negate the adhesion factor are road debris, and lean limit. I was riding a lowered bike, and he said "I'd put a lift kit on mine if they made one" I get it now. So as long as you don't corner in gravel, and don't drag your frame, you are unlikely to exceed your bikes limits in a turn. Sure enough, 30 years later, I'd say he was right....
#106
Look where you want to go not we're you're afraid you're going. Relax and have confidence the bike can handle the turn and the limitation is you. I've seen more guys go off onto the shoulder or cross the double yellow from target fixation instead of looking where they want to go. Breath, shift your body for the turn, be smooth after sometime going through turns at speed can be a Zen like experience.
#107
Only limitation I have found is lean angle. I can't corner as fast on my Heritage without scraping the boards. I don't mind doing that but once I dragged the support. That scared the crap out of me! I think you'll find the bike can handle the corners and you'll just have to slowly push your speed and gain confidence.
#108
It took alot of courage to come to this forum with your issue and honestly ask for help. Despite the fact that most of us, in our heart of hearts, want to be smartasses, usually earnest requests for assistance are met with a majority of people trying to be helpful. You've received lots of good advice here. I know you will be able to put it in practice.
Ride safe!
Ride safe!
#109
I face the same "thing" not really that often, but when it does happen .. its the same ...
Im heading straight feeling comfy on the road and all of a sudden a bend in the road. Not a "turn" but def requires some lean. I find myself not prepared for it, and feel like im going too fast into it ... im hesitant to lean enough to take the turn ... that hesitation has me drifting closer and closer to the guardrail on the side.
As i get closer and feel "the situation" i can no longer "look through the turn", because im too worried im going to hit the guard rail and wipe out. I then begin semi-panic breaking, and begin to further freak out because i know i shouldn't be breaking on a turn, and what that can result in.
Im just a mess
Im heading straight feeling comfy on the road and all of a sudden a bend in the road. Not a "turn" but def requires some lean. I find myself not prepared for it, and feel like im going too fast into it ... im hesitant to lean enough to take the turn ... that hesitation has me drifting closer and closer to the guardrail on the side.
As i get closer and feel "the situation" i can no longer "look through the turn", because im too worried im going to hit the guard rail and wipe out. I then begin semi-panic breaking, and begin to further freak out because i know i shouldn't be breaking on a turn, and what that can result in.
Im just a mess
Secondly, as has been mentioned, you're struggling with target fixation. You see the guardrail, you think "I better not hit that guardrail", and you fixate on that guardrail. When you fixate on it, you stare at it, and when you stare at it, you head right towards it. No good. Instead of focusing on what you want to avoid, it is paramount that you focus on where you want the bike to go. Once you've started to develop the target fixation habit, this can be easier said than done, but trust us. It is absolutely what you must do. Turn your head and eyes and look down the road in the lane you want to be traveling in.