Howdy,
Working on upgrades again. After reading opinions that the stock intake manifold is prone to crackes (esp here in F'N hot Phoenix), I dedided to upgrade to a S&S 55mm intake manifold and while I was at it, move up to the 5.5.
The stock injectors are 4.3 gpm..With some of the mods I have done, I was running out of "oomph" at mid RPM and up. The S&S is the same size as the stock intake manifold, however, it has a better flow. I did not get the one that is completly polished on the inside. Why? Actually the A/F mixture DOES need to have some turbulence to mix up before entering the haed chamber. I did smooth out some of the edges to match the gasket. Of it was VERY minimal. And I also upgrade to the 5.5 GPM injectors. Call V&H for an upgrade map, flash and rode.
I just rode 3 days, 500 miles, 2-up with the tourpack on. Works GREAT. And my butt-dyno can tell the difference. From about 2500rpm up, it revs up faster, hits 4500 sooner than before.
If you see my signature, you see what I have and done. I have the 107. My buddy has the 114, V&H headpipe, CFR, 447 cam and HD tuners. The dealer said not to put it on becasue it would flood and bog down the bike and engine. .....really? Dont believe.

On the ride, ever gas stop when we filled up we were within point 1 (4.5 vs 4.6, 2.4 vs 2.5) of gas added. Mine gas consumption was a bit more. I have the 2017 Ultra with the couch back seat tourpack. He has the SGS. So just the weight difference make the difference in gas mpg.

What are your thoughts if you have added the S&A and the 5.5 injectors?
(someone will say, go bigger to the 64mm and bigger injectors. After I do the cam kit, then time for the next upgrade)

 

the "turbulance" issue that you've brought up is a bit erronious. the injector sits right above the tintake valve, so fuel does not travel the length of the intake like it would on a carbed bike. Keep that in miond for the next time. the CNC ported version is not entirely smooth on the inside either, i've installed several of them.
I would be willing to bet that you'd get a lot better performance from your bike if you will willing to ditch the VH tuning product and have it pro tuned by a reputable shop with a Powervision or TTS Mastertune.
m

 

yes, a BIT erronious. Correct. injectors on TOP of intake manifold...however, DOES spray into the intake manifold JUST before enters into head chamber. Yes, the ported version is NOT completely smooth.
Now, about the tuner.
I have not been able to do ALL of the work I want at the same time. Too much money. So I have been slowly making changes.
first step was slipons... i liked the sound. No DYNO, saved $550
To improve the sound and a bit more performance, decat head pipe and removed wadding around the baffles (V&H HO), left the baffles in. No dyno, saved $550
Modified stock AC. Similar to SE. No dyno, saved $550
Then put on a V&H FP3. Spent $400, I installed. Before everyone make this into a discussion about tuner vs dyno , or oil,
SOMETHING is better than nothing. V&H has been doing this stuff for many many years, they do dyno runs with hundreds of configurations to come up with a "canned map"

WOULD YOU AGREE?

Now I added the S&S intake and 5.5 injectors. V&H send another map. No dyno, saved $550
Last step for now is a compelete cam kit. V&H will send another map, no dyno, saved $550

NEXT, I WILL GO GET A INDY DYNO TUNE AND PICK UP EVERY OUNCE OF HP & Tq AVAILABLE. At that time will be the time to removed the V&H tuner. Outlived the usefullness.
spend $550, ONE TIME and then leave it ...(for now....whats next? heads)

Yes, a pro indy dyno tune is better.

 

I added a ported S&S intake manifold and 5.5 injectors to my stage 2 street bob with a Redshift 468 cam. Bike screams and throttle response improved. Its a good move. My fuel mileage stayed about the same.

 

i would not agree, but then again, I'm a profession dyno tuner.
I have NOT had any kind of good luck with the FP3unit on anything other than stage 1 stuff, lots of people have come to me to correct the issues that come up with it,,,,,,
m
Steve Cole says it pretty well,

the best you know is not necessarily the best there is,,,,,,,or something to this effect.

 

sounds like fly by the seat of the pants
there are +/-'s for everything.
that said, EVERYTHING must play nice. the engine is finite per build, not infinite! you can go too big and actually, sometimes smaller is better.
butt dyno is wranger, calvin cline or levi ???
perhaps your diff is in the angle of the dangle or the pattern. logs vs twigs
a dyno is a tool, nothing more!! it is a predictor NOT a guarantee. seen tooooooo many shade trees smoke a dyno guy.

 

If only every change was not a new dyno charge. I went to a local shop here. Great place, $525. Add the intake and injectors, $525 + $250 for license for first dyno.
Add cam kit, $525

once I get the bike done, I will go to a indy dyno tuner.

 

Good dyno guys?

 

true story
since i am from odessa, i followed texas racers one of which was aj foyt.
in his early years he was shade tree or garage king since dynos were not as easily to come by like today.
one day at a track around houston, there were several guys running the track for sport when aj showed up in his chevy wagon.
at first he did not want to run but long story short they pretty much egg'd him on so he got on the track. he was smoking them left and right and some were dyno dudes.
they all got together and cried foul so he let them put sacks of concrete in the back of the wagon, toooo long to remember how many but i am going to guess about 500 pounds.
WELLLLLLLL
he smoked them WORST than before for little did they know it, that extra weight made the lite weighted rear hook up faster
long story short, they NEVER questioned him again. in later years, yep the dyno was in the picture.
the thing about a dyno is that it is only for that moment in time and usually in a very controlled environment. we had computer controlled drivers on some of our compressors and it could do dyno on the fly and we used it to determine where the driver needed maintenance or whether OVH was in the future. those numbers in a run are in that moment of time since power is dynamic and changes by the second, even back to back is diff.
so it is a predictor not gospel. even the dude in the seat can make a diff.

 

yep,
before computers on drag race cars, we did by hand and ear. trial and try again.
So I understand the dyno is at the moment. Even the video about tuning they mention temperature, humidity as factors.
I just know with computer EVERTHING on engines now, gotta use a computer (phone, laptop, etc) to see and make changes.
Since most every system can be changed, the trial and try again doesn't seem doable.

Other than a dyno, what other method is there to tune a bike?