The Fuelpak Pro is available through distribution, so that could be from a few distributors depending on where you're located. I can also get you in touch with our international account sales rep if it turns out that you can't get it through your distributor.

Once registered the Fuelpak Pro comes with a cloud-based dealer server that will allow you to make manual changes to the cell tables on any computer's browser, then download those files back to the FP3 to flash the bike. It's not quite the same as having a true Windows based PC application with a wired connection, but what we lose in that form of connectivity, we gain in the versatility that comes with a wireless system. Since you're not physically tied to a PC you can take the bike out and tune it on the road if your dyno has a failed part or that PC is having issues, and any tech in your shop can have full access to your cloud-based server to download previously tuned maps and flash them into an unlimited number of bikes, all from their personal phones.

Bryan
Brand Manager, Electronics

 

Hi Bryan, thank you for all the info. Good to know that the FpPro is available for the end user as well..couldn't see how it would be a viable business decision otherwise.

Would be nice to speak to you in person but I live on the side of the world (India) so this forum is the best way to communicate right now. coming back to FP3 development itself, I jus like to know is anything being done to improve the issues and shortcomings mentioned in my previous posts and the emails I've sent you guys.

Any great product is only great cos of its 'ease of useability..don't get me wrong FP3 is a great product for the average user who just uses it to flash a map and be done with it, but for us advance users it's limiting in many ways.

**A windows based software is imperative for FP3. Can't tell you how tedious it is to input all the VE and Timing numbers manually looking at the phone or tab screen (been through this several times when making custom maps from WinPv and Screamin Eagle software for my sporty.. And No i don't own a shop or work for any dealership). Im sure u guys have done ur research and case studies of the Screamin Eagle, DynoJet WinPV and other software's..then why is it that, in this day and age the software for FP3/Pro is closed looped to "dealer only" cloud based environment.

**like in my previous posts and emails, The important options within the FP3 App sub categories are missing based on Year and not based on the system itself(J1850/CAN Bus) this is not the case with the other product software's. One such Example among other discrepancies within the FP3 App is :

my bike '13 sporty (J1850)
-> View/Edit Map
-> Startup and Idle
*IAC Warm up steps
*Idle RPM

'14 - 16' Sporty (CANBus)
->Startup and Idle
*Cranking Fuel
*Warm up Enrichment
*IAC crank steps vs Temp
*IAC crank steps to run
*IAC Warm up steps
*Idle RPM


'17 - '19 Sporty (CANBus)
->Startup and Idle
*IAC crank steps vs Temp
*IAC crank steps to run
*IAC Warm up steps
*Idle RPM

I emailed you guys back in '17 about missing important options such as Cranking Fuel and Warm up Enrichment tables (which i needed to adjust cos of my bike doing the "hot startup knock") among other suggestions for improvements..it's 2019 and I'm still missing these options (and Yes I have reduced the timing where startup occurs but it doesn't fully solve the issue)(just a side note Cheyne has been great on the replies for emails, but these underlying issues are unresolved)

Also what's with the new updated menu layout with brackets and bottom row icons and toggles..looks like a bad 80's arcade game menu. If this was done to simplify, then it certainly doesn't have a simplified appeal.

So to conclude these are my queries and inputs, hope they are appreciated. Thank you again for the updates Bryan, Wishing you and ur team the best as always. Plz do make the necessary changes at the earliest.
Warm Regards

 

 

This was primarily performed because the server is part of an overall digital marketplace that will be launched in the near future, allowing dealers/shops to place a monetary value to their maps, and distribute/sell them to customers worldwide. We were concerned about people with less tuning experience/expertise putting out bad maps on this marketplace.

I'm glad that you had a great experience with Cheyne, he's awesome! I'll get with our lead developer and see if I can determine why the basis for our server structure files are so vastly different among the model years/ECM/ECM Firmware versions. I suspect the Firmware version is the root cause, and this should be remedied hopefully with something our server developer is currently cooking up.

Cheyne and I got together to come up with an easier to navigate layout for all of the available tables, and after living with it for a bit, I'm honestly not feeling it either. Our current plan is to do a complete rehash and reskin of the app within the next year, change the main menu with a new GUI, gamify the experience a bit , and generally make the app something more powerful and fun.

Totally appreciated! I think that you have a lot of excellent points and insight, and it's definitely something that gives me a little more leverage in the event I want to push through a requested change.

 

Ooh yeah..this is was the kinda response i was lookin forward to, kudos on the elaborate reply Bryan.

Pretty much the answer I was expecting..but do you really think ppl have so much time in their lives to deliberately go online, login into software environment, mess up a tune for fun and put it in the market place to make money..! and some helpless soul will accidentally buy this tune. Who is this guy, 'The Joker from Batman And if it was a unintentional human error then the end user would have messed the tune in the FP3 App anyway, right..guess thats where the warranty diclamers come into play and rightly so.

Which is a good segway into my next point. Like previously mentioned the discrepancies between model years, *In the FP3 App -》Sportster '17 to '19 (all maps) the Acceleration Enrichment through out the temperature range is pre-set to 3.98 which is the max value and denoted in red..i know this ain't right, even crossed checked with maps in WinPv and SEPT..again i told cheyne abt this in my email back in 2017..and the fact that its not fixed till now shows the average users simlpy aren't unaware of it and actually questions the regular QC checks at Vance&Hines, no offense **Plus did you know that the CAM Selection menu within the FP3 App brings up all the cams irrespective of the bikes engine platform.! Another way for a novice user to mess things up royally. U see where I'm going with this Bryan

Bottom line is, no matter how u slice it..novice users messing up their own maps is not the basis on which you deny ur advance customers the access to the products software. Which brings back the question "why did you restrict ur online browser based software to dealers only and why the browser based environment at all?

Correct me if I'm wrong here..so if a dyno shop is tuning a bike..
1. they open the browser and get to the V&H page
2. Login, to the get to the software environment for editing the Map
3. Make the necessary changes
4. Save it (Log out cos logging in at two places would be red flagged)
5. Open the App on the phone
6. Login to dealers tools
7. Gets the saved map
8. Flash it
9. Run the dyno

(Also you can't say.. One can do the remaining Map editing from the mobile App cos of the missing options thingy, remember)

Solution : A Windows based Application that directly connects to the FP3 on the bike..every good laptop in the last 10 years has Bluetooth connectivity. Why is this not a viable option for you guys..plz plz do explain Simply put, a shop wants to tune a bike.
1. Opens the App in Windows
2. Connects to the bike's FP3
3. Makes changes to the Map
4. Flashes it to the ECU
5. Dyno runs

Maps in Market place for monetary value, really?? Everyone knows No two vehicles run the same, even with identical components. They should be tuned individually for the best performance..tuner shops are the first to tell u this. So why would i spend even 2 bucks on a caned shop Map (to run auto tune again) when i can get a free base map from V&H server for my component combinations (besides it's marketed that V&H also creates their Maps on dyno so we don't have to.! V&H own words)

I sure hope what ever cooking is going on, there is some major restructuring and updates coming soon bryan..fingers crossed, can't wait two more years for things to get fixed


Well i do like the logo, the pop up screen and connectivity page menus are straight forward n cool too..Will look forward to the reskin (a preview would be better before u guys go full bore with it) but for now can you plz bring back the older interface, with some omissions of GUI for Throttle Progressivity, Decel Pop and Active exhuast..I honestly feel a separate GUI page for these options are unnecessary...more gauges and layout options on the View sensor data page, I wrote about why it's needed on my previous posts on this thread..also can you add VE and Timing pages on the sensor data scroll screens with a live marker for monitoring purposes. The four wheeler industry has some awesome inspiration to draw from..espically Ford GT's dash, '19 mustang as well..I'm sure ur team has looked into the Beemers and Merc's too.

Thanks again Bryan, jus doing what i can to help improve the product..and from what I've read in this forum and xlforum, i believe you really need to push for big changes on the software front to make the FP3 and FpPro popular for dyno shops and advance users. Looking forward to the updates and changes. Cheers

 

Firstly, I love all of the Jokers...Jack Nicholson, Mark Hammil, Heath Ledger, Jared Leto, and I'm excited to see Joaquin Phoenix's take on the iconic character. That being said, we're trying to protect the dealers/shops for which the server was designed, and bad maps floating around due to human error or intent is bad for them, V&H, and the motorcycling community as a whole.

I just tested and confirmed the bug, and filed a bug report to the team in order to get this fixed. My request to the team in an initiatives email included the camshaft thing, and I requested it be sorted automatically by VIN designation...need to follow up on this.

So it actually works like this for the first time:
1) Download base map from server
2) Put bike into AutoTune mode with Fuelpak Pro installed after making manual run changes
3) Dyno tune the bike
4) Upload map to server
5) Configure fitment on the server

Second time looks more like this:

1) Open App and login to Dealer Tools Menu
2) Download map directly from personal server and flash into bike
3) Verification run or fine tuning if required
4) ???
5) Profit

While you are totally correct in that no two bikes behave precisely the same due to a number of factors, having been touring the unit around for the past 6 months and running countless dyno demonstration sessions all over the country in different climates and elevations (I'm typing this from Denver airport right now in fact), the general margin of error is within the capabilities of the ECM's fuel trims.

Hypothetical situation time...I run a shop that has a technician that is locally known as the best dyno tuner in town, but he's booked out for 3 weeks, and you just finished getting your bike back together after installing the big bore kit you've been dreaming about. If I were to give you an option for say half the cost of the actual dyno time for your precise combination (let's say I've built and mapped a few of that same kit), and you could ride it this weekend, or wait three weeks and pay full pop for that extra 1-4%, which would you do?

I know there are some people who just want their bike back, and in certain parts of the country and globe the riding season is short and every week counts, they may opt for the map now. Others will want to squeeze every last drop of blood from the stone, and wait the 3 weeks for my tuner to free up. I'm not stating that there is no need for a dyno tune, or that one way is better than the other, just that every customer and situation is different which is something I learned managing Service Departments. Fluidity, flexibility, and making customers happy is the absolute priority in any shop environment, as it is a service industry after all. Having a bike for too long, over-promising and under-delivering, lack of communicating with a customer, and lacking creative and constructive solutions to everyday problems is how a department slowly bleeds out and dies as their customers go elsewhere to get work performed. Customer retention and happiness is number one...always. Also, the marketplace is totally opt-in and not required, so a shop isn't having their hand forced into anything, just being offered another tool in their toolbox. Just don't tell my wife....she already thinks I have too many tools.

I don't know man, I've seen the length of your posts and you seem fairly patient. All kidding aside, my interest is in finding creative and simple solutions that make everyone's enjoyment and use of the product an overall better experience.

Perfect! I've definitely been looking around in other industries for inspiration wherever I can get it. Not sure if removing the GUI for those tables is the right answer for the masses, or shoving them off to a separate section so more advanced users don't have to see them. I think that leaving the option for manual manipulation of the individual tables, and maybe reconfiguring the UI, along with additional education, is probably closer to being on the right track.

Cheers bud!

Bryan
Brand Manager, Electronics

 

Got a real quick and simple question for you, Bryan... are they thinking about/have they implemented at least some basic data logging... i.e., I want to see what my top HP/torque is, so I set up the display and put my smart phone on the bars, then go to my favorite long, clear view freeway onramp and get on it. Now I have to keep one eye on the phone trying to catch the peak value... would be MUCH better to make the run, then get safely off the road and check on the peak value stored.

Same applies for many other things, mpg and the like... what say you?

 

Here’s my take as a tuner. What the most important value to putting a “fresh” build on a dyno is what can be seen, heard, and monitored/recorded for that all important first sessions the engine and bike runs.
A partial list includes catching...
Intake leaks, exhaust leaks, throttle actuation adjustments, belt, chain, and tire pressure adjustments, non-functioning sensors, wiring issues, and the most important value? ...Catching sumping and cam timing errors!! See both all too often.
NOW it’s ok to go ahead a tune it.
As always, just my biased opinion ;-)
Bob

 

I don't and never will do social media so I will possibly miss out on the so called special announcement I saw on the V&H website. From above it looks like I will also not see great tips and tricks.

It is a bit of a joke also that social media is so good companies have to advertise it on their websites.

Just put whatever it is on your website for everyone, job done!

 

As a tuner. I have no idea why a tuning product would not allow you to view logged data. How most of the problems get solved at my shop.