I have the electronics manual for an 06, might be same for his might not.
But I am NOT going to scan it an post it.
He can go buy his own.
Besides it is a violation of copyright law for me to do that.
But being the helpful guy you are I'm sure you will explain it in full detail for him.
Now did he have a tssm before and dropped to just a tsm or did he have a tsm and replaced
it with another factory tsm, he hasn't yet said.
If he had tssm and replaced with same or tsm and replaced with same, then his problem
is most likely elsewhere.
But if he went from tssm to tsm there could be a wiring harness problem that prevents that.
Thus causing his current problem.
I would have to do research on that fact.

But if he won't buy a manual to help himself, then why should I.
Just like a few days ago on my buddies fuelly that died. I posted here looking for input.
One person made a raw basic suggestion fuel or spark. But gave no reasoning why one or the other or how to check and prove or disprove theory. But not one person on here offered any real assistance form their manual or experience.
I did post it after the fact, because I already had it running, I just wanted to see what kind of return help I would receive. Practically nothing, but yet I should give out all the valuable
info that it cost me a lot to learn, and you won't even buy $140 in manuals????
The one guy that did respond a couple times nicely, I walked him through the procedures
I followed and why I did it that way (to prove / disprove a possiblity as everything intereacts).
I hope he understands why I did as I did.
Took about a half hour to explore, eliminate, and prove the final result. 2001 EGCU F.I.
with no special tools except one an inline spark checker. Oh and my brain!! To be able to interpret what I was seeing.

 

i can think of a reason or two why.......

 

Just ignore Choo Choo. He's always an AZZhat and he's always trying to make himself look good. Now that's funny!

 

Hey, DumbA's like me appreciate you techno guys and your advise and banters. Thanks



APO

 

Never claimed to be the post police.
And seems you never read all the posts or you would have seen my qualifications.
I'm not retired military.
Did 7 years in the corp doing ELECTRONICS on choppers and jets.
took auto tech in high school and college.
Taught auto tech and electronic ignition and fuel injectionat college.
Worked as a mechanic for others (small shops, national chains,) for many years.
Worked as heavy truck and heavy equipment field mechanic for over 10 years.
working in the field (15 20 miles from town in oilfields etc) you can't just run to
town to get an answer about something.
You need to learn and understand the basics in your head and how everything interacts together. They are not just isolated mechanical systems any more.
No one item controls the fuel supply and timing and ignition. They all interact together
moreso now than ever.
Then you need the basic manuals with you (now days they are loaded on laptops)
and all the tools you could possibly need.
Yep sometimes you do get f..ed in the field and need something.
But few construction companies put you in the field on your own unless you can do just
about everything that comes up, so you got to have a well rounded education.
Anybody that can read and memorize things can pass an ASE test. doesn't mean you
are any good at it. But for your info I have taken and passed 5 different sections of the ASE
certification tests better than 20 years ago.
don't use everything every day and don't keep up with everything out there.
But I worked in the mechanical repair field from 1974 when I got out of corp till a couple years
ago, when I went to work for the US Government. Now I do other things.
Yes a lot of info is available in different sections on this and other forums and elsewhere on the web.
But like I said if you spend $20k approx on a bike and intend to do some work on it yourself
and you don't also buy the manual then why should I give you everything for free.
so I am going to harrass you about NOT buying the manual.
Kinda like friends, strangers and inbetween walking into the shop and asking to "borrow"
my tools to work on their car in the lot! I had three tools I would lend jewelrs screw driver,
36 inch pipe wrench and a 15 pound sledge. they were all on 3 foot chains by the door.
If you could fix the car yourself with those limitations, you were welcome to use the tools I BOUGHT AND PAID FOR TO EARN MY LIVELYHOOD!!
But yeah I still did favors from time to time.
Now if you don't understand ignition systems at all, do a google search or go to library and get a book on the basics to understand how a gasoline internal compbustion engine works.
Then upgrade to basic electronic ignition, then fuel injection.
If you understand the basics the rest will fall in line. Then if you have bothered to take the time
to better yourself and bought the manual but get confused and need more info or explained
in a different way than a book, I will be happy to try and explain and point in the right direction.
And yes damn it I have been wrong and have overlooked some things . Never claimed to have ALL the answers and now a days I don't have time to study and read up on EVERYDAMN system
out there.
But unless I missed something in this entire post and I may have, still haven't heard from O.P.
is it OEM, same for same or aftermarket or changing from one to another.
Not going to bother looking anything up to see what the manual says unless I have all the info,
would be a waste of time.
[quote]ORIGINAL: skratch

[quote]ORIGINAL: choochoo

Because so many of you AZZEs (not all) come here wanting anything and everything for NOTHING.
so many are too cheap for whatever reason to buy the DAMN MANUALS for your
Bikes!!!
It's one thing to have a manual and not have enough experience and be confused and need a little extra help.
But it's totally another thing to come here with nothing!

 

Thanks guys for your help, and thanks Chooche for the laughs I got while you were making an azz out of yourself, Glad that your the only jerk I have ran into so far here, most are extremely helpful...and yes it was an OEM part. I don't have an electrical manual yet, and even if I wanted one today, I would have to order it and wouldn't have it for a week or so. But rest assurred, I will go out and buy one just to please you s.i.r....

 

However, did you confirm by testing that the tsm or tssm (two different items)
was what was really at fault and are interchangeable without a wiring problem?
without the manual it would be difficult at best.
Also the turn signals for timing is routed through the speedometer.
so it is possible a turnsignal failure could have been there too, depending.......
I hope for your sake that by just changing out parts it worked.
But apparently in your original post you had problems with the replacement unit.
Hopefully the link worked for you that someone else provided.
I would have to go back and read all the posts to see who it was.
But I think all Skratch did was attack me.
But still a manual purchased when you bought the bike could have been beneficial to you
and every one else that has a future problem
I don't believe I made an azz out of myself.
I warned everyone here a long time ago I was going to be more hard cased about standing up for yourselves against the dealer and MOCO if you feel you have a legitimate complaint and you do nothing about it.
In the end it makes it better down the road for everyone.
and the same goes for ALL of you that buy a bike (new or used) and have any intention of working on it yourself, but don't buy the necessary repair manuals to go along with it.
Then come here for technical information that is in the book.
That others here and elsewhere spent money on and may or may not have posted here or elsewhere for you to get for free. What are you giving back? If you don't have the book?
If you come here and ask for info that would not be expected to be in the book, then that's different.
Like we used to say when I was doing mechanics professionally, "pick my brain, fill my pocket!"

Like I said before, if you at least have the manual and still have trouble understanding something
because of lack of experience and you provide ALL needed info up front,
I have no problem trying to help you out with my past experience, or looking in my manual
and see what it says and if it will help you. course this depends on if I have the time to look it up.

 

i wouldn't say that i attacked you.... i was just wanted to know exactly what experience you had that made you such an expert and everyone else an idiot.... now that you have answered that, i can place a little stock into what you say. at least you didn't say 'well i stayed at a holiday inn express last night....' and just to get some assumptions out of the way, i did in fact purchase the fsm and parts manual right after getting my bike. no, i don't have the electrical troubleshooting manual (hopefully i won't be needing that soon) yet. and i do have a pretty good background in maintenance also.

i didn't say that i read all your posts, what i did say was that in all that posts that i have read..... big difference.

i do agree with you on one point, if you buy a motorcycle (price irrelevant), you should be prepared to at least do some of the maintenance on it yourself.

 

The service manual is a good start and valuable information.
But it doesn't have the trouble shooting info the electronics manual has.
And with everything electronic now (no more carbs) you got to have one
if you want to have any hope of diagnosing a problem.
You need a good digital volt ohm meter, one that will read and display a digital
signal not just an analog.
An analog volt ohm meter can fry a sensor or the ECM if hooked up wrong.
CKP is just a generator, it developes a more or less A/C signal to the ECM
This signal tells the ECM that NUMBER one and only Number one cyclinder is
at proper time for fire, and to keep the fuel pump running and it computes number two
from that signal.
the tssm/ tsm now incorporates security codes to disable the system as anti theft.
But also has the bank angle senor in it. If moved mounted wrong the ECM thinks Bike
is laying on its side and kills the ignition.
Cam sensor works with the ECM and CKP to determine time to fire injectors and the spark.
The MAP tells the computer if you are at low or high altitude, idling, cruising, applying throttle
to pass or wide open thottle if air is cold and dense or hot and thin, by way of a pressure
differential and it's signal is a digital one
Would you like me to cover all the other sensors and possibilities, It would take a long time.
That's why I harp,
get the manuals and read them,
go to the web and google basic F.I. , carbs, Internal combustion.
See how each works and are interrelated.
then tell us what you have learned and observed to help us, and if you then have a problem or are confused and looking for something you may have overlooked we all can help you better.
And if you add in high lift / duration cams then you got another problem added in vacuum!

 

reponse to skratches last item on maintenance

I don't care if you do some or none of the general maintenance yourself.
If you have an indy or a dealer do it.
But you should be at least somewhat knowledgeable about the bike and how things
work. Tends to save problems later when a less than reputable dealer or indy tries to
scam you.
Local dealer did his best last month with my G/F, then tried same tactic on me and should have known better, cause he knows my qualifications personally, but he jumped on his bosses band wagon. they all ended up with their collective tit in the wringer.
They ended up fixing the bike under warranty.
and as many here are starting to see, many "trained" Hd techs are just parts changers
making guesses and many just have no clue HOW THE SYSTEM works.
remember the air gauge it's normal, or it reads the engine intake air temp etc.
But if you are going to do anything more than wash wax, change the fluids, get the manuals.
If not it's not fair to those of us who have went to the expense to do so to comepick our brains.
If you do have them and you are confused that's different.
You can at least tell us where in the book you are confused.
Plus when you find something new and interesting in the repair you're doing you can then tell us and we all learn.
From time to time I will throw out real life scenarios, try and solve them.
Ask pertinent questions of how and why, be surprised at what you learn.
Me too. I overlook or forget things too. and sometimes I'm just plain lazy or it doesn't pertain to me so I didn't study it. but a tidbit goes a long way.
good luck on the turn signal / no run problem and be sure to tell us what it was in the end and what you found out. I don't have a tssm on mine.