117 Cvo Limited....2nd engine in 2000 miles
#41
10-02-2018, 07:59 AM
Heatwave did your last replacement engine sump as well? I thought you were happy with that one and was convinced something was different with it that guaranteed it would not sump again even in your guaranteed to sump route that caused your previous engines to sump. Trying to figure out what changed judging by your changed tone on these threads?
Here’s what changed that effected my tone. A great company with unbelievably loyal customers is being run into the ground by management that’s more focused on e-bikes and new adventure bikes than spending the $ it takes to correct a serious catastrophic design defect in the M8. Once these 2019s started sumping within less than a month after launch it was clear to me that this once great company is off the rails. Silence and blind loyalty will NOT help them get back on-track!
Last edited by Heatwave; 10-02-2018 at 08:02 AM.
#42
10-02-2018, 08:16 AM
#43
10-02-2018, 08:25 AM
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Im about to pull my hair out but i cant. Im bald. Im 58 years old been riding harleys since 1980.
i figured id treat myself to a new 2018 CVO Limited with the 117 C.I. engine. And i did. At 600 miles the oil pump sumped and bike overheated and died. Bike went to dealer. I went to Uber with my girl and went home.
Oil pump was changed for the "revised" oil pump and two weeks later i got my bike back.
The bike ran until 700 miles then the engine started to sound like it was coming apart. Back i go to dealer. This time the cam assembly bracket had cracked. They replaced both.
Why no recall or bulliten on this i dont know. They replaced it or them not sure with a "redesigned" bracket.
How there was a redesigned improved bracket in july when i just took delivery end of April i dont know.
On the dealers test of the brand new top end it overheated again at 13 miles. They also found the pistons scoring the walls of the cylinders. I requested a new engine from millwalkie. They said sorry. I begged. They said sorry.
i posted this story on the stockholders web site and 3 days later i had a new engine. Problem solved. No.
With new engine on 75 degree day riding 1 up the bike again overheated to 308 degrees and sumped. The bike was full of oil cold before i left the house. I was on the return leg of 200 mile day and the bike got sluggish on the highway.
i pulled over and checked the engine temp it was 308 degrees and there was no oil on the stick meaning at least a quart of oil was sumped and stuck up in the engine not able to find its way down to the pan.
Shes back at the dealer now and they said the cylinders are also scored again. They have a few 117's doing this and the fact that an engine replacement didnt fix this issue is concerning.
The bike will be down about 8 weeks in total since end of April.
I love this bike. It is the most powerfull bike ive ever had and the most gorgeous machine ever....but....it is unreliable as is the Factories ability to get to the root cause.
wish me luck...
thanks
i figured id treat myself to a new 2018 CVO Limited with the 117 C.I. engine. And i did. At 600 miles the oil pump sumped and bike overheated and died. Bike went to dealer. I went to Uber with my girl and went home.
Oil pump was changed for the "revised" oil pump and two weeks later i got my bike back.
The bike ran until 700 miles then the engine started to sound like it was coming apart. Back i go to dealer. This time the cam assembly bracket had cracked. They replaced both.
Why no recall or bulliten on this i dont know. They replaced it or them not sure with a "redesigned" bracket.
How there was a redesigned improved bracket in july when i just took delivery end of April i dont know.
On the dealers test of the brand new top end it overheated again at 13 miles. They also found the pistons scoring the walls of the cylinders. I requested a new engine from millwalkie. They said sorry. I begged. They said sorry.
i posted this story on the stockholders web site and 3 days later i had a new engine. Problem solved. No.
With new engine on 75 degree day riding 1 up the bike again overheated to 308 degrees and sumped. The bike was full of oil cold before i left the house. I was on the return leg of 200 mile day and the bike got sluggish on the highway.
i pulled over and checked the engine temp it was 308 degrees and there was no oil on the stick meaning at least a quart of oil was sumped and stuck up in the engine not able to find its way down to the pan.
Shes back at the dealer now and they said the cylinders are also scored again. They have a few 117's doing this and the fact that an engine replacement didnt fix this issue is concerning.
The bike will be down about 8 weeks in total since end of April.
I love this bike. It is the most powerfull bike ive ever had and the most gorgeous machine ever....but....it is unreliable as is the Factories ability to get to the root cause.
wish me luck...
thanks
When replacing the entire engine doesn't fix it, then that's a helluva problem!
#44
10-02-2018, 08:26 AM
The first time it overheated to the point where the computer shut it down i was in 35 mph wounded warrior procession, 2 up, on my 15th mile or so. Oil was burnt up per dealer. Oil pump failure per dealer. Temps over 315.
Cam bracket as they called it cracked about 700 miles after the 600 mile pump failure. Also saw cylinder scoring with scope per dealer.
Factory decided to allow 2 new heads, pistons, jugs all that stuff. After assembly, it overheated on the dealer durring a test ride 13 miles into a 20 mile ride.
New engine installed.....
Two weekends ago i was on highway returning home 6th gear running with traffic about 80 mph.
Bike got slugish. Found temp at 308 and oil dip stick dry.
added 1 qt.
Let it cool and rode home speeds at 60 mph. Got home temps 285. Brought to dealer. He scoped cylinders found both scored by pistions.
so basically this motor or these motors failed both at low rpm and crusing rpm.
2200 miles on the bike.
ill say again. I love this bike. Dont want to lemon law it yet but.....so far things dont look good.
Cam bracket as they called it cracked about 700 miles after the 600 mile pump failure. Also saw cylinder scoring with scope per dealer.
Factory decided to allow 2 new heads, pistons, jugs all that stuff. After assembly, it overheated on the dealer durring a test ride 13 miles into a 20 mile ride.
New engine installed.....
Two weekends ago i was on highway returning home 6th gear running with traffic about 80 mph.
Bike got slugish. Found temp at 308 and oil dip stick dry.
added 1 qt.
Let it cool and rode home speeds at 60 mph. Got home temps 285. Brought to dealer. He scoped cylinders found both scored by pistions.
so basically this motor or these motors failed both at low rpm and crusing rpm.
2200 miles on the bike.
ill say again. I love this bike. Dont want to lemon law it yet but.....so far things dont look good.
#45
10-02-2018, 08:35 AM
Certainly possible. But my 4th engine was built as a “one off” Stage IV 117 engine at the factory. As far as I know thats never been done before. I have no idea what was different about the insides of my engine or that it wouldn’t sump after more miles than 1700. All I know us that it ran well for the time I had it. No clue if they did something unique or used off the shelf parts to build that engine.
#46
10-02-2018, 08:44 AM
Certainly possible. But my 4th engine was built as a “one off” Stage IV 117 engine at the factory. As far as I know thats never been done before. I have no idea what was different about the insides of my engine or that it wouldn’t sump after more miles than 1700. All I know us that it ran well for the time I had it. No clue if they did something unique or used off the shelf parts to build that engine.
Exactly my point. So it’s possible to build one that doesn’t so it’s not a core problem in the design. The search for the root cause continues. As an engineer I find this issue fascinating. I’m sure the MOCO does as well. It’s as bad for them as the effected owners so I am confident they are frantically trying to figure it out as well.
#47
10-02-2018, 09:02 AM
Exactly my point. So it’s possible to build one that doesn’t so it’s not a core problem in the design. The search for the root cause continues. As an engineer I find this issue fascinating. I’m sure the MOCO does as well. It’s as bad for them as the effected owners so I am confident they are frantically trying to figure it out as well.
Equally unfortunate is that after 3 model years of sumping M8s I would no longer characterize HD’s pursuit of a solution to sumping as “Frantic”.
Last edited by Heatwave; 10-02-2018 at 09:05 AM.
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misbell (04-29-2019)
#48
10-02-2018, 10:18 AM
Unfortunately I simply couldn’t get to the same conclusion you reached on only 1700 miles. My first M8 engine went 5500 miles before the first real signs of sumping.
Equally unfortunate is that after 3 model years of sumping M8s I would no longer characterize HD’s pursuit of a solution to sumping as “Frantic”.
The following users liked this post:
bradsULtd (10-03-2018)
#49
10-02-2018, 11:34 AM
One art form that seems to have been perfected in all of this is keeping a lid so tight on issues that no supposedly unbiased reviews ,and there are many, throughout the internet mention this sumping issue that effects so many. Just promotional hype. No reviews mention the symptom my bike and several others had from new of low stumbling warm idle and the chirping and screeching noise from the lower end that so many exhibit. Only on my third try at a different dealer was I able to have my issue acknowledged and hopefully finally resolved.
#50
10-02-2018, 11:47 AM
Outstanding HDF Member