Technical challenge for you geniuses...
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Cruiser
Joined: Jan 2008
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Technical challenge for you geniuses...
I have seen numerous comments on this site stating that when you get popping out of your exhausts that it indicates a lean fuel condition. I respectfully disagree with that position. So do the people at S&S. They've been building high performance V-twins for decades. A lean condition causes back spit into the carburetor and
not out of the pipes. After putting on a set of fatcats, and re-tuning the Super G carb, I found this to be true. Check out their tuning instructions for their carbs. They put these conditions in print. Perhaps, the best support for this is seeing a bike popping, and blowing flames out of its exhaust. How could a lean condition cause this? Now. a rich condition, whith fuel seeping out of the cylinder and igniting on the exhaust stroke makes a lot more sense doesn't it? And, the earth is not flat. Love you guys, let's hear the wisdom. No name calling please, you bastards.
[IMG]local://upfiles/51874/EE39A4BD6A3848D3B3C292F6D16739E9.jpg[/IMG]
Tourer
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 426
Likes: 0
From: Illinois
RE: Technical challenge for you geniuses...
two things are the primary cause of backfiring: fueland spark. Valve timing can play into it as can your choice of pipes (reversion) or a combination there of.
lets not confuse the issue with talking about carb vs FI either. So what's the topic gonna be; our FI bikes popping or your Carb scenario?
If your are talking about the joe average late model (05 and up) that just added SE/AC, sliponsand a tuner of their favorite flavor, that pretty much eliminates valve timing leaving pipes and AFR levels. 90% of the late model FI bikes/maps are on the lean side of the house so there's your populous answer.
First you have to determine wether you are either lean or rich based on your AFR levels.
lets not confuse the issue with talking about carb vs FI either. So what's the topic gonna be; our FI bikes popping or your Carb scenario?
If your are talking about the joe average late model (05 and up) that just added SE/AC, sliponsand a tuner of their favorite flavor, that pretty much eliminates valve timing leaving pipes and AFR levels. 90% of the late model FI bikes/maps are on the lean side of the house so there's your populous answer.
First you have to determine wether you are either lean or rich based on your AFR levels.
Banned
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 956
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From: SoCal
RE: Technical challenge for you geniuses...
ORIGINAL: edtexas
I have seen numerous comments on this site stating that when you get popping out of your exhausts that it indicates a lean fuel condition. I respectfully disagree with that position. So do the people at S&S. They've been building high performance V-twins for decades. A lean condition causes back spit into the carburetor and
not out of the pipes. After putting on a set of fatcats, and re-tuning the Super G carb, I found this to be true. Check out their tuning instructions for their carbs. They put these conditions in print. Perhaps, the best support for this is seeing a bike popping, and blowing flames out of its exhaust. How could a lean condition cause this? Now. a rich condition, whith fuel seeping out of the cylinder and igniting on the exhaust stroke makes a lot more sense doesn't it? And, the earth is not flat. Love you guys, let's hear the wisdom. No name calling please, you bastards.
[IMG]local://upfiles/51874/EE39A4BD6A3848D3B3C292F6D16739E9.jpg[/IMG]
I have seen numerous comments on this site stating that when you get popping out of your exhausts that it indicates a lean fuel condition. I respectfully disagree with that position. So do the people at S&S. They've been building high performance V-twins for decades. A lean condition causes back spit into the carburetor and
not out of the pipes. After putting on a set of fatcats, and re-tuning the Super G carb, I found this to be true. Check out their tuning instructions for their carbs. They put these conditions in print. Perhaps, the best support for this is seeing a bike popping, and blowing flames out of its exhaust. How could a lean condition cause this? Now. a rich condition, whith fuel seeping out of the cylinder and igniting on the exhaust stroke makes a lot more sense doesn't it? And, the earth is not flat. Love you guys, let's hear the wisdom. No name calling please, you bastards.
[IMG]local://upfiles/51874/EE39A4BD6A3848D3B3C292F6D16739E9.jpg[/IMG]
RE: Technical challenge for you geniuses...
I thought I was a genius just for getting a Harley....but seeing all the tech tips and threads around here made me think otherwise. Oh well, mama always saidthat Iwasn't smrt.
Cruiser
Joined: May 2007
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From:
RE: Technical challenge for you geniuses...
I've yet to see a bike where decel popping was caused by a too rich condition, no matter what S&S says. Personally I think S&S outta pull their heads outta their asses and realize that fuel injection is here to stay. I went to my first electronic fuel injection class in 1979,damn near 30 yrs ago,and I wouldn't trade electronic fuel injection for all the carburetors in the world.
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Cruiser
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RE: Technical challenge for you geniuses...
S&S is leading fuel injection technology in the American V-twin market. Do a search on their new x-wedge engine. It is light years ahead of Harley injection technology. So, don't spout
negativity until you have the facts. Personally, don't know about injected bikes and your comments may indeed be correct. In Dallas a lot of guys that ride fast Harleys run the PSI carb,
that allows you to adjust your carb's fuel mixture with a finger turn of a ****. They run O2
sensors with AF meters and adjust their ratios without leaving the seat. The last three visits
by the travelling Dyno Drag Trucks had them finishing 1st and 2nd, beatingall other Customs
and Harleys. They both had Touring Bikes with S&S engines, Speeds intakes, and D&D Boarzillas.
It never ceases to amaze me how many, many guys with fuel injection talk about visits to the dyno at their dealers every time they make any kind of change to their bikes. If I'm not mistaken, these visits can cost anywhere from $200 to $400 dollars. Seems like it would be
a lot easier to adjust a **** to adjust your fuel mixture. So you buy a new air cleaner for a
hundred and fifty bucks and you have to have a $400 re-tune? What's wrong with this picture?
How about new pipes, bigger cams,bigger jugs? All new visits to the dyno? I know it's so because I've read dozens of comments on this site to that effect. How about all of the guys
that just had their bikes retuned, only to find out that they run worse, so they are forced to
go back for another tune? Don't be bragging too much on the vfi.By the way, S&S offers a
two year warranty on their carbureted 124" Run the Boarzilla, upgrade the super G carb, or
run the PSI carb and you are putting out 144 hp and 150 ftlbs tq. Show me a Harley engine
through a dealer that can do that? Even the Jims 120" for Harley pales in comparison.
negativity until you have the facts. Personally, don't know about injected bikes and your comments may indeed be correct. In Dallas a lot of guys that ride fast Harleys run the PSI carb,
that allows you to adjust your carb's fuel mixture with a finger turn of a ****. They run O2
sensors with AF meters and adjust their ratios without leaving the seat. The last three visits
by the travelling Dyno Drag Trucks had them finishing 1st and 2nd, beatingall other Customs
and Harleys. They both had Touring Bikes with S&S engines, Speeds intakes, and D&D Boarzillas.
It never ceases to amaze me how many, many guys with fuel injection talk about visits to the dyno at their dealers every time they make any kind of change to their bikes. If I'm not mistaken, these visits can cost anywhere from $200 to $400 dollars. Seems like it would be
a lot easier to adjust a **** to adjust your fuel mixture. So you buy a new air cleaner for a
hundred and fifty bucks and you have to have a $400 re-tune? What's wrong with this picture?
How about new pipes, bigger cams,bigger jugs? All new visits to the dyno? I know it's so because I've read dozens of comments on this site to that effect. How about all of the guys
that just had their bikes retuned, only to find out that they run worse, so they are forced to
go back for another tune? Don't be bragging too much on the vfi.By the way, S&S offers a
two year warranty on their carbureted 124" Run the Boarzilla, upgrade the super G carb, or
run the PSI carb and you are putting out 144 hp and 150 ftlbs tq. Show me a Harley engine
through a dealer that can do that? Even the Jims 120" for Harley pales in comparison.
Extreme HDF Member
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 13,402
Likes: 941
From: Illinois
RE: Technical challenge for you geniuses...
When I put low restrictive exhausts and intakes on two of my crusiers, I got decel poping which I cured with Cobra's F2000r programers. I did the install myself. Please can I be called a genius?
[IMG]local://upfiles/49894/BF869BEAC47B4C7F9D52D422CA79AC76.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]local://upfiles/49894/BF869BEAC47B4C7F9D52D422CA79AC76.jpg[/IMG]
Ultimate HDF Member
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 8,642
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From: Forest Lake, Mn
RE: Technical challenge for you geniuses...
ORIGINAL: edtexas
S&S is leading fuel injection technology in the American V-twin market. Do a search on their new x-wedge engine. It is light years ahead of Harley injection technology. So, don't spout
negativity until you have the facts. Personally, don't know about injected bikes and your comments may indeed be correct. In Dallas a lot of guys that ride fast Harleys run the PSI carb,
that allows you to adjust your carb's fuel mixture with a finger turn of a ****. They run O2
sensors with AF meters and adjust their ratios without leaving the seat. The last three visits
by the travelling Dyno Drag Trucks had them finishing 1st and 2nd, beatingall other Customs
and Harleys. They both had Touring Bikes with S&S engines, Speeds intakes, and D&D Boarzillas.
It never ceases to amaze me how many, many guys with fuel injection talk about visits to the dyno at their dealers every time they make any kind of change to their bikes. If I'm not mistaken, these visits can cost anywhere from $200 to $400 dollars. Seems like it would be
a lot easier to adjust a **** to adjust your fuel mixture. So you buy a new air cleaner for a
hundred and fifty bucks and you have to have a $400 re-tune? What's wrong with this picture?
How about new pipes, bigger cams,bigger jugs? All new visits to the dyno? I know it's so because I've read dozens of comments on this site to that effect. How about all of the guys
that just had their bikes retuned, only to find out that they run worse, so they are forced to
go back for another tune? Don't be bragging too much on the vfi.By the way, S&S offers a
two year warranty on their carbureted 124" Run the Boarzilla, upgrade the super G carb, or
run the PSI carb and you are putting out 144 hp and 150 ftlbs tq. Show me a Harley engine
through a dealer that can do that? Even the Jims 120" for Harley pales in comparison.
S&S is leading fuel injection technology in the American V-twin market. Do a search on their new x-wedge engine. It is light years ahead of Harley injection technology. So, don't spout
negativity until you have the facts. Personally, don't know about injected bikes and your comments may indeed be correct. In Dallas a lot of guys that ride fast Harleys run the PSI carb,
that allows you to adjust your carb's fuel mixture with a finger turn of a ****. They run O2
sensors with AF meters and adjust their ratios without leaving the seat. The last three visits
by the travelling Dyno Drag Trucks had them finishing 1st and 2nd, beatingall other Customs
and Harleys. They both had Touring Bikes with S&S engines, Speeds intakes, and D&D Boarzillas.
It never ceases to amaze me how many, many guys with fuel injection talk about visits to the dyno at their dealers every time they make any kind of change to their bikes. If I'm not mistaken, these visits can cost anywhere from $200 to $400 dollars. Seems like it would be
a lot easier to adjust a **** to adjust your fuel mixture. So you buy a new air cleaner for a
hundred and fifty bucks and you have to have a $400 re-tune? What's wrong with this picture?
How about new pipes, bigger cams,bigger jugs? All new visits to the dyno? I know it's so because I've read dozens of comments on this site to that effect. How about all of the guys
that just had their bikes retuned, only to find out that they run worse, so they are forced to
go back for another tune? Don't be bragging too much on the vfi.By the way, S&S offers a
two year warranty on their carbureted 124" Run the Boarzilla, upgrade the super G carb, or
run the PSI carb and you are putting out 144 hp and 150 ftlbs tq. Show me a Harley engine
through a dealer that can do that? Even the Jims 120" for Harley pales in comparison.
IH - you are a GENIUS, maybe a li'l aged like myself, but a genius none the less.
Guess the term would be "experienced genius" Personally, I leave the EFI to those with the training and equipment. I'll just keep tinkering with my carbs, somedays that is con-fussing enuff.