Anti-seize or threadlock
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Seasoned HDF Member
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From: New York
Anti-seize or threadlock
I recently added bags to my Softail Deluxe. Because I wanted the flexibility to remove the bags when not needed, I got a quick disconnect system. Problem is, I already had a docking setup for my detachable passenger backrest. I did not want to give that up. So, I had to piggyback the bag docking system with the backrest docking system. I'm not thrilled with how far the double docking setup sticks out, but it's function over form.
To add the bag docking system, I needed longer bolts. During the install, I realized that the bolts extend into the rear wheel well. Naturally, bolt length is critical to avoid a weak connection [too short] or create a tire-shredding device [too long]. I also recognized that the bolts I removed, while in excellent shape, had clearly been subjected to all kinds of road grime which naturally accumulates in the wheel well. Being located in the northeast, my bike might also be exposed to road salt. Consequently, the thought occurred to me that the new bolts should have some protection to avoid having them permanently bond to the fender bracket. I thought "anti-seize"; however, research appears to indicate otherwise.
Here is one reply on the topic from another forum:
To add the bag docking system, I needed longer bolts. During the install, I realized that the bolts extend into the rear wheel well. Naturally, bolt length is critical to avoid a weak connection [too short] or create a tire-shredding device [too long]. I also recognized that the bolts I removed, while in excellent shape, had clearly been subjected to all kinds of road grime which naturally accumulates in the wheel well. Being located in the northeast, my bike might also be exposed to road salt. Consequently, the thought occurred to me that the new bolts should have some protection to avoid having them permanently bond to the fender bracket. I thought "anti-seize"; however, research appears to indicate otherwise.
Here is one reply on the topic from another forum:
"ADVrider's very own Loctite rep finally chiming in to give you my take from on anti-seize.
The only place I put any anti-seize is on the threads on the spark plug and on the studs/nut on the head pipe.
Everything else gets a blue threadlocker.
Threadlockers cure to a thermoset plastic that won't dissolve in water, fuel coolant, or oil. If water can't work it's way inbetween a nut and bolt assy. it can never rust together.
Threadlockers also prevent galvanic corrosion-the white powdery buildup most commonly found when two dissimilar metals are in contact with each other. To prevent galvanic corrosion, we just have to take one of the ingredients out-the airspace in between the nut and bolt. The threadlocker fills the airspace.
C5-A copper anti-seize is good for 1800F, Silver/1600F, Nickel/2400F.
Anti-seize, at least the metal filled ones are nothing more than metal dust, sometimes some graphite, and grease. A/S keeps the threads from locking and rusting where the nut engages the bolt. Once the grease evaporates (and it does) we're left with metal dust on the threads.
Some of us here are good with context clues. Well if we look at the word anti-seize, the stuff won't ever reliably lock a fastener to prevent loosening from vibrational forces-that's why we have threadlockers.
Most anti-seizes have a "K-Value" aka lubricity value from 0.13 to 0.18. Why is this important T=KFD...Torque=K*Clamp load*nominal diameter of the bolt.
Anti-seizes and threadlockers lubricate the threads so more accurate clamp loads can be achieved.
The only time I ever recommend an anti-seize is in high heat applications (think header studs and nuts)
Folks choose an anti-seize based on temperatures, but they are also based on the types of chemicals the application might be exposed to. You'll never find C5-A at a plant that makes chlorine for example."
I'm still open to any suggestions members here can offer; however, I think I've found my answer and hopefully this can help others.
The only place I put any anti-seize is on the threads on the spark plug and on the studs/nut on the head pipe.
Everything else gets a blue threadlocker.
Threadlockers cure to a thermoset plastic that won't dissolve in water, fuel coolant, or oil. If water can't work it's way inbetween a nut and bolt assy. it can never rust together.
Threadlockers also prevent galvanic corrosion-the white powdery buildup most commonly found when two dissimilar metals are in contact with each other. To prevent galvanic corrosion, we just have to take one of the ingredients out-the airspace in between the nut and bolt. The threadlocker fills the airspace.
C5-A copper anti-seize is good for 1800F, Silver/1600F, Nickel/2400F.
Anti-seize, at least the metal filled ones are nothing more than metal dust, sometimes some graphite, and grease. A/S keeps the threads from locking and rusting where the nut engages the bolt. Once the grease evaporates (and it does) we're left with metal dust on the threads.
Some of us here are good with context clues. Well if we look at the word anti-seize, the stuff won't ever reliably lock a fastener to prevent loosening from vibrational forces-that's why we have threadlockers.
Most anti-seizes have a "K-Value" aka lubricity value from 0.13 to 0.18. Why is this important T=KFD...Torque=K*Clamp load*nominal diameter of the bolt.
Anti-seizes and threadlockers lubricate the threads so more accurate clamp loads can be achieved.
The only time I ever recommend an anti-seize is in high heat applications (think header studs and nuts)
Folks choose an anti-seize based on temperatures, but they are also based on the types of chemicals the application might be exposed to. You'll never find C5-A at a plant that makes chlorine for example."
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Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Apr 2015
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From: New York
BTW, I'm sure many on this forum understand the implications of the following statement - I did NOT:
Most anti-seizes have a "K-Value" aka lubricity value from 0.13 to 0.18. Why is this important T=KFD...Torque=K*Clamp load*nominal diameter of the bolt.
Anti-seizes and threadlockers lubricate the threads so more accurate clamp loads can be achieved.
I inadvertently stumbled on another website which explained that both anti-seize and threadlock products are lubricants. As such, any desired torque values are affected. Consequently, if spec on a dry nut/bolt connection should be 10 lbs., one would evidently be over-torquing an assembly with anti-seize or threadlock because of the lubricating affect these compounds have. Conceptually, I get it. Practically, I'm not sure what to do with this new-found knowledge.
Anti-seizes and threadlockers lubricate the threads so more accurate clamp loads can be achieved.
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Dec 2005
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From: poway
Torque your bolts less.. One of the interesting things is that HD wants you to torque case screws too high. IMO even if the screw is dry.. The problem is that the TQ spec for some screws seem to be for screws with Locktite patches, which can require higher torque than dry treads and much higher than wet thread lockers..
The answer is torque your bolts less when using wet thread lockers or antisleeze.
Here is a calculator that lets you see what happens to get required clamping pressure when friction coefficient is changed.
http://www.futek.com/boltcalc.aspx
The answer is torque your bolts less when using wet thread lockers or antisleeze.
Here is a calculator that lets you see what happens to get required clamping pressure when friction coefficient is changed.
http://www.futek.com/boltcalc.aspx
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