Dyno can't set the factory CPU to work with new pipes and air cleaner without also buying a tuner, either from H-D or aftermarket.

Here are your options.

1) H-D Stage 1 download. A dealer loads new maps into the factory CPU to work with a typical Stage 1 setup. Still limited to EPA fuel-air restrictions for exhaust emissions. Some people are satisfied with this, others are not. If you will never do cams or engine work, this might suffice.

2) H-D tuner (Screamin Eagle Race Tuner or Screamin Eagle Super Pro Tuner). With this, a dealer will dyno your bike and, using this tuner, load new maps into your factory CPU. They can't do the modifications without you buying the tuner.

3) Aftermarket tuner. There are various options here, with the majority being piggyback units. The factory CPU remains untouched. With most of these, you can load a canned map based off the engine you're running, intake, and exhaust that will get you reasonably close to a custom dyno tune, but not 100% there. There are also tuners that aren't piggyback units, but instead replace the bike's CPU. And there are still others, like the Power Vision, which flash (load into) the bike's factory CPU.

 

AH ok ... so the power commander w/ auto tune is gonna get me pretty close but the dyno will be 100% ... i understand now ok so if i only do new air cleaner and pipes and do the commander it should get the air fuel mix etc close enough to where i shouldn't have decel pops or dead spots in accel .........but isnt gonna be drag strip ready w/o dyno

 

I don't know much about tuning and all the details behind all the tables either. I went with the Power Vsion because it seemed to be the easiest to use plus you can't discount the support you get from Fuel Moto which is first rate. However, you will have to wait for the autotune module a little longer as it is not yet released.

 

if you're worried about having to change the map back to stock later on, you can get two maps on your PCV and put on a switch to go back and forth. Would that not work? And yes, getting it dyno tested would be the best, and having the auto-tune would be great too, but unless you are really looking to get every last hp out of your bike, I'm sure you'll be happy with the map loaded on it for you from Fuel Moto.

 

awesome thats what i think i was going after .... will the auto tune get me in a close range ... im not looking to get every hp out of it i understand it wont do thst but if i could hook up the pcv and auto tuner and get it to where the bike wasnt popping etc (running smooth) and could switch back and forth (stock to upgrade) incase i go back overseas thats great if not wont even bother till i know im home for good

 

Is this a troll?

 

I went with a T-max with the wide band O2 sensors so the "autozone" would be possible. I also installed 2.25 inch Rush mufflers and an Arlen Ness Big Sucker (breather). While I've dyno tuned my cars equipped with programmable computers...like you I was hoping the Tmax "autozone" open cycle would take care of most issues. It didn't and really can't...but...with a little work and patience you can make the bike run well...the way you want it to run. After I loaded the recommended base map...the bike fired up perfect...and would start when hot right off and idles where I set it...840 rpm rather than the factory 1000 rpm. The OEM ECM never started that bike easily...and there were dead spots....high idle....etc. The Tmax basemap....even after several weeks of autotuning did leave me with severe pinging at specific rpm and TPS positions...and some annoying backfiring. I forced myself to read the Tmax manual and followed their tuning instructions...dyno not required....I eliminated the ping spots...and the bike runs great...I even figured out how to lower the head temperature at idle...though I still found it necessary to install a parade fan...you do lose ability to kill the back cylinder for heat management and you lose miles-to-empty function at least on 2010 Softail eventhough Zippers will tell you they have a procedure to restore DTE.

Unfortunately none of the aftermarket ECMs are automatic...I chose the Tmax after talking to Harley mechanics at HDs store in Daytona...off the record they told me to buy a Tmax from someone else rather than Harley's SERT-Mastertune. I got similar recommendations from other very capable wrench turners. If you are anywhere near Lakeland FL....there is a great little shop there and one of the guys will install it and tune it for you....but more than likely you will find it necessary to fool with it a bit more yourself. I'm very satisfied with the Tmax...its easy to understand and super flexible.

One last issue for you to consider...make sure your CANBUSS will operate with aftermarket ECMs. My Mercedes GT CANBUSS had to be removed and new harness made up so I could run the engine with a TECII ECM.

I think the 2011 Softail runs on a CANBUSS.

 

ok .. sorry been on travel ... so after reading all this it seems the auto tuner is a gimmick and a waste of time and money ... so my next question would be if i buy the main computer ( tmax or power commander, etc) is there one that i can dyno on stock save it and then redyno with the upgrades save that and be able to switch back a forth between the 2? again my concern is i would love to get new pipes and a ness big sucker but if i move back overseas it'll get costly to pay for a dyno every time i move between states and europe

 

The Power Vision allows you to store up to 6 maps on the device and switch between them. It should be available for the 2011 softails sometime in April (info from Fuel Moto).

The Power Commander V has an optional switch module that will let you switch between 2 maps.

I don't know about the Thunder Max.

I just found out about another tuner from this forum a couple days ago...
http://www.revperf.com/Precision/index.html
This looks to do what you are looking for. As long as you don't change displacement more than 20% the system tunes itself.

 

I've seen a lot of members say don't want to dyno's all the time... Who does?

But really I wonder How many times and how often are U planning to change things.?

If planned right most do stg1,then at a later time some do cams only. Few do a BB kit at the same time as adding cams...

If U can do the Stg1 and cams at the same time then that dyno should be about the only one needed.

Point is, I did the stg1, dyno was $180, $60 x 3hrs... back in 07...
in 09 did cams during winter special, dyno was free with cam job. so in 4yrs Ive spent $180 on dyno's.. If I had choose to change pipes at that time they said no charge on install as the pipes were off anyway for the cams.

True if I changed pipes and cams every yr I have to pay for a dyno if I didn't get the special.

But how many really changes out that often.? Seems those I ride with once they install a set of pipes and/or cams they pretty much leave them alone after that.