SERT confusion
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Road Master
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,154
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From: South Bend, In
SERT confusion
There seems to be some confusion about the SERT with some newbies so lets clear it up.
A SERT
Screaming Eagle Race Tuner or (SERT) is a tool used to reprogram the ECM. After the ECM is programed, the tool or interface is stored for later use. You can only use the tool or interface on one bike. It is married to that ECM and cannot be used on multiple bikes. This means that there is no module piggy backing the ECM. So what you are paying for is the tool or interface, not a module or hardware.
A PCIII (Power Commander)
This is a module that is piggy backed to the ECM. The programming is stored in the module not the ECM. If the module fails the tune is gone however if you remove the module and reconnect the ECM solo the factory tune is still there. If the ECM failsit will not matter what type of tuner or module you are using you will not be riding that bike anywhere.
There are several different types of fuel management system available. All I believe piggy back the ECM except for the SERT.
Now, when comparing prices to a SERT-vs- PCIII I don't think it's fair to compare these to each other. A SERT is a tool used to obtain a custom tune. Although a PCIII is also used to obtain a custom tune it is a module. An additional piece of hardware that stays on the bike. It is exposed to all the elements however is not as rugged as the ECM. So use whatever makes you happy. I personally use a SERT. This is what I prefer. They don't fail unless the ECM does which is not likely.
A SERT
Screaming Eagle Race Tuner or (SERT) is a tool used to reprogram the ECM. After the ECM is programed, the tool or interface is stored for later use. You can only use the tool or interface on one bike. It is married to that ECM and cannot be used on multiple bikes. This means that there is no module piggy backing the ECM. So what you are paying for is the tool or interface, not a module or hardware.
A PCIII (Power Commander)
This is a module that is piggy backed to the ECM. The programming is stored in the module not the ECM. If the module fails the tune is gone however if you remove the module and reconnect the ECM solo the factory tune is still there. If the ECM failsit will not matter what type of tuner or module you are using you will not be riding that bike anywhere.
There are several different types of fuel management system available. All I believe piggy back the ECM except for the SERT.
Now, when comparing prices to a SERT-vs- PCIII I don't think it's fair to compare these to each other. A SERT is a tool used to obtain a custom tune. Although a PCIII is also used to obtain a custom tune it is a module. An additional piece of hardware that stays on the bike. It is exposed to all the elements however is not as rugged as the ECM. So use whatever makes you happy. I personally use a SERT. This is what I prefer. They don't fail unless the ECM does which is not likely.
Banned
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 3,499
Likes: 2
From: CANADA
RE: SERT confusion
Ya learn somethin' new every day on HDF! Phil, ya forgot to mention 2 auto-tuning systems that REPLACE the factory ECM....ThunderMax & DTT! As for prices, newbies DARE to compare...I prefer PCIII. Also MOST important...the experience of the tuning technician.
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Road Master
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,154
Likes: 0
From: South Bend, In
RE: SERT confusion
ORIGINAL: bountyhunter
Ya learn somethin' new every day on HDF! Phil, ya forgot to mention 2 auto-tuning systems that REPACE the factory ECM....ThunderMax & DTT! As for prices, newbies DARE to compare...I prefer PCIII. Also MOST important...the experience of the tuning technician.
Ya learn somethin' new every day on HDF! Phil, ya forgot to mention 2 auto-tuning systems that REPACE the factory ECM....ThunderMax & DTT! As for prices, newbies DARE to compare...I prefer PCIII. Also MOST important...the experience of the tuning technician.
Elite HDF Member
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 3,515
Likes: 6
From:
RE: SERT confusion
ORIGINAL: strtgld
There seems to be some confusion about the SERT with some newbies so lets clear it up.
A SERT
Screaming Eagle Race Tuner or (SERT) is a tool used to reprogram the ECM. After the ECM is programed, the tool or interface is stored for later use. You can only use the tool or interface on one bike. It is married to that ECM and cannot be used on multiple bikes. This means that there is no module piggy backing the ECM. So what you are paying for is the tool or interface, not a module or hardware.
A PCIII (Power Commander)
This is a module that is piggy backed to the ECM. The programming is stored in the module not the ECM. If the module fails the tune is gone however if you remove the module and reconnect the ECM solo the factory tune is still there. If the ECM failsit will not matter what type of tuner or module you are using you will not be riding that bike anywhere.
There are several different types of fuel management system available. All I believe piggy back the ECM except for the SERT.
Now, when comparing prices to a SERT-vs- PCIII I don't think it's fair to compare these to each other. A SERT is a tool used to obtain a custom tune. Although a PCIII is also used to obtain a custom tune it is a module. An additional piece of hardware that stays on the bike. It is exposed to all the elements however is not as rugged as the ECM. So use whatever makes you happy. I personally use a SERT. This is what I prefer. They don't fail unless the ECM does which is not likely.
There seems to be some confusion about the SERT with some newbies so lets clear it up.
A SERT
Screaming Eagle Race Tuner or (SERT) is a tool used to reprogram the ECM. After the ECM is programed, the tool or interface is stored for later use. You can only use the tool or interface on one bike. It is married to that ECM and cannot be used on multiple bikes. This means that there is no module piggy backing the ECM. So what you are paying for is the tool or interface, not a module or hardware.
A PCIII (Power Commander)
This is a module that is piggy backed to the ECM. The programming is stored in the module not the ECM. If the module fails the tune is gone however if you remove the module and reconnect the ECM solo the factory tune is still there. If the ECM failsit will not matter what type of tuner or module you are using you will not be riding that bike anywhere.
There are several different types of fuel management system available. All I believe piggy back the ECM except for the SERT.
Now, when comparing prices to a SERT-vs- PCIII I don't think it's fair to compare these to each other. A SERT is a tool used to obtain a custom tune. Although a PCIII is also used to obtain a custom tune it is a module. An additional piece of hardware that stays on the bike. It is exposed to all the elements however is not as rugged as the ECM. So use whatever makes you happy. I personally use a SERT. This is what I prefer. They don't fail unless the ECM does which is not likely.
I use a PCIII This is what I prefer at the moment even with its slow start issue. But Ive never experanced a falure with one and have had several over the years. Added plus, say you decide to sell or trade in your bike, I can remove my PCIII, expensive mufflers and aircleaner returning to stock form. If I had a sert I could re map to stock form (if there is a stock map on the cd) and remove the other items but my 400+ SERT would go with the bike. I think anyone thinking of doing anything to a 07 should study all the options, and decide, Im waiting on thundermax users to post some dyno runs before changing from the PCIII.
Road Master
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,058
Likes: 6
From: Omaha Nebraska
RE: SERT confusion
Compared to the PCIII, the SERT has more tuning options, controlandflexibility and in the right turner's hands, an engine can be tuned more precisely. One major reason is this, The HD's Delphi ECM is a Speed Density based system, meaning that the fuel and spark is directly compensated by the engine's RPM Vs load as the vacuum is monitored by the MAP sensor. The SERT programming also is aSpeed Density system allowingthe tuner to fine tunethe fuel and sparkcomplementing theECM's internalstratagy. However, the PCIII is not a Speed Density tuner, it is an Alpha-N tunerwhich means that it will only adjust fuel and spark based off of RPM Vsthrottle position monitored by the TPS sensor.With this conflict, the tuner cannot zero in on a givenRPM and load as can be done withthe SERT. There are certain engines, combinations and quircksthat having such tuning capabilities are a nessesity.
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Intermediate
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 31
Likes: 0
From:
RE: SERT confusion
So if I trade my bike and set up the new bike with the same pipes & A/C, etc.and buy a new SERT, I should be able to copy the map created with the old SERT into the new SERT software and download it to the new ECM? No need for a new dyno?
Same question applies if the ECM dies; Buy a new ECM and SERT, copy the old map and re-download it to the ECM?
Same question applies if the ECM dies; Buy a new ECM and SERT, copy the old map and re-download it to the ECM?
Thread Starter
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Road Master
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,154
Likes: 0
From: South Bend, In
RE: SERT confusion
My only intension for this post was to clear up some confusion about the main differences between the two, one being a tool to reprogram and the other that rides piggyback with the ECM nothing more.
Yes the SERT cost more, Yes you can custom tune with the PCIII, I said that in the original post, and Yes there are other products out there. Which one is best can be debated until we are all blue in the face. I personally like the SERT better, BH personally likes the PCIII better. It does not matter to me what people use I was just trying to help some of the newbies understand the major differences between the two.
Do research, research, research.
Yes the SERT cost more, Yes you can custom tune with the PCIII, I said that in the original post, and Yes there are other products out there. Which one is best can be debated until we are all blue in the face. I personally like the SERT better, BH personally likes the PCIII better. It does not matter to me what people use I was just trying to help some of the newbies understand the major differences between the two.
Do research, research, research.
Club Member
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 5,335
Likes: 0
From: Tidewater
RE: SERT confusion
OK I got to ask the question. I have an 05 Road King Custom. I bought it from the dealer with Rinehart pipes, and stage 1. Does that mean there was a SERT used and I do not have it? OR do the HD dealers have 'universal' kits they can use if someone wants to just have the work done in their shop? Please tell me bc if there is a SERT that goes with my bile I want ot!
Thanks.
Mike
Thanks.
Mike