Lifter bleed down issue
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Lifter bleed down issue
Had to change my cam tensioner shoes on my 04 fxst, all went well until l reinstalled the pushrods, followed the manual and several vids on you tube but can't seem to get exhaust lifter to bleed down, piston at tdc....intake pushrod is fine, can spin the pushrod but the exhaust is clearly still under load and wont budge, done the waiting thing but still no good, lots of conflicting advice about prefilling/soaking the lifters, manual doesnt mention that, would it be easier if l disassembled the lifters thus removing all oil as l'm assuming the manual refers to new lifters....any help much appreciated.
Loosen the pushrod and turn the motor while watching the top of the lifter - it will be obvious when it is on the base circle of the cam - the lifter will have moved closest to the engine case and stay there - you will be able to rock the engine back and forth and the lifter will not move.
You do not need to disassemble the lifter. At this point you're probably on the lobe and the lifter is completely bled down. When you adjust the pushrod, it will take very little at this point to depress the plunger in the lifter.
You do not need to disassemble the lifter. At this point you're probably on the lobe and the lifter is completely bled down. When you adjust the pushrod, it will take very little at this point to depress the plunger in the lifter.
Last edited by Ed Ramberger; Mar 25, 2018 at 05:41 PM.
I agree - That's why I told him to watch the lifter - it's easier for most to get. He's on a lobe or has completely compressed the plunger.
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From: poway
I disagree.. The pushrod adjusts the same no matter where it is on the cam.. Take out the slack, screw it down X turns, let the lifter bleed down and it should spin free. IMO there is either something wrong with the way he's doing things of the lifter is stuck.
My bet is that the lifter don't have enough oil in it to bleed down and it is simply collapsing. The OP is running the lifter down until it gets tight then adjusting from there. At that point the lifter is already completely collapsed. He should simply slack the lifter till there is play then slowly take out the play by moving the pushrod up and down gently. At that point do the preload turns.
The other possible issue is that during the adjustment process, the lifter collapsed and stuck.. That is easy to see as with the pushrod loose, the pushrod cup should be up against the lifter retaining clip.
My bet is that the lifter don't have enough oil in it to bleed down and it is simply collapsing. The OP is running the lifter down until it gets tight then adjusting from there. At that point the lifter is already completely collapsed. He should simply slack the lifter till there is play then slowly take out the play by moving the pushrod up and down gently. At that point do the preload turns.
The other possible issue is that during the adjustment process, the lifter collapsed and stuck.. That is easy to see as with the pushrod loose, the pushrod cup should be up against the lifter retaining clip.
If you adjust it anywhere off the base circle, the pushrod will be too short when it's on the base circle or at any point lower on the ramp - you will also not have a valve that opens fully (if the pushrod stays in place.)
Last edited by Ed Ramberger; Mar 25, 2018 at 09:55 PM.
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From: poway
Max - You're incorrect. if you were on the nose of the cam and adjusted like you say, you would have zero valve opening because the valve would be closed and you would have just adjusted the plunger down .100" Then, when it came off the nose, the pushrod would be too short by the amount of cam lift and be loose. That's why they have to be adjusted on the base circle - to get the .100" (or whatever the engine builder perefers) plunger compression and allow for opening the valve.
If you adjust it anywhere off the base circle, the pushrod will be too short when it's on the base circle or at any point lower on the ramp - you will also not have a valve that opens fully (if the pushrod stays in place.)
If you adjust it anywhere off the base circle, the pushrod will be too short when it's on the base circle or at any point lower on the ramp - you will also not have a valve that opens fully (if the pushrod stays in place.)
Add:
BTW If the lifter was adjusted on the cam lobe, the pushrod will likely be found loose not tight.
Last edited by Max Headflow; Mar 25, 2018 at 10:18 PM. Reason: Add:
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Max - I said 2x that the lifter could be completely bled down, and I also said the pushrod would be too loose if adjusted on the lobe.
I agreed with Dave because something is obviously wrong but if you'll notice the last statement in that post was the lifter could be collapsed (again - for the second time I believe). I was just trying to get the OP to the easiest way of adjusting the pushrods - just watch the lifters. If he didn't realize the lifter was collapsed, and he was confused about where to adjust, visually watching them is just easiest. If you need validation that you can adjust the pushrod anywhere on the cam lobe and it should bleed down you are correct - I admit I missed that part and was just thinking mis-adjusted in general. if you think I'm going to argue in a forum about something as silly as that you're mistaken.
While the intent of your post may have been the plunger could be compressed, and I understand the concept that the lifter will bleed down anywhere on the cam, the way you posted it clearly told the OP just to adjust it anywhere on the lobe and let it go. So in your effort to prove yourself correct, if anyone had followed what you said, they would have had a mis-adjusted pushrod - read your post - it clearly says to adjust it anywhere and let it go..
Then - again to correct me - you went back and edited you post to say the pushrod would be loose just after I explained in detail how the pushrod would be loose.
Don't really understand where you're going here but not going to argue about it. Seems like you don't read the entire post then want to dissect minute points. The real intent should be to help this guy get his bike running not diverting into who can prove the other guy wrong.
I agreed with Dave because something is obviously wrong but if you'll notice the last statement in that post was the lifter could be collapsed (again - for the second time I believe). I was just trying to get the OP to the easiest way of adjusting the pushrods - just watch the lifters. If he didn't realize the lifter was collapsed, and he was confused about where to adjust, visually watching them is just easiest. If you need validation that you can adjust the pushrod anywhere on the cam lobe and it should bleed down you are correct - I admit I missed that part and was just thinking mis-adjusted in general. if you think I'm going to argue in a forum about something as silly as that you're mistaken.
While the intent of your post may have been the plunger could be compressed, and I understand the concept that the lifter will bleed down anywhere on the cam, the way you posted it clearly told the OP just to adjust it anywhere on the lobe and let it go. So in your effort to prove yourself correct, if anyone had followed what you said, they would have had a mis-adjusted pushrod - read your post - it clearly says to adjust it anywhere and let it go..
Then - again to correct me - you went back and edited you post to say the pushrod would be loose just after I explained in detail how the pushrod would be loose.
Don't really understand where you're going here but not going to argue about it. Seems like you don't read the entire post then want to dissect minute points. The real intent should be to help this guy get his bike running not diverting into who can prove the other guy wrong.
Last edited by Ed Ramberger; Mar 26, 2018 at 05:57 AM.
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From: san antonio
Back off and remove the pushrod and verify that the piston on that cylinder is at TDC on the compression stroke. Check the lifer to verify that the cup is up against the retainer and not stuck. Reinstall the pushrod and slowly lengthen the pushrod checking vertical movement per Max's instruction until there is no more vertical movement. Adjust pushrod the desired number of turns; the OP should feel some resistance whether the lifter has oil or not as the spring has some resistance whether the lifter is full of oil or not.
All should be good at this point but if not, I would remove the lifter, take it apart, check it out and replace if necessary. I would not rotate or start the motor until I was damn sure the lifter was functional and the pushrod properly adjusted.
All should be good at this point but if not, I would remove the lifter, take it apart, check it out and replace if necessary. I would not rotate or start the motor until I was damn sure the lifter was functional and the pushrod properly adjusted.