Crankcase Venting for TC, Is it necessary?
MOST of the vapor, you guessed it, WATER. you do know water injection is used to boost power even in fighter jets, so why is it harmful???
old 60's and back just dumped to the ground and epa and research data showed environmental issues. the issue is not the data but stupidity. if you ever lived in cali back before emission were put in place, it was smog city, so who hurts, everyone! ever drove into chicago??? 90 miles out, it looks like tires burning on the horizon!!!!
i worked on industrial engines for 47 years and they ran 24/7/365 full bore beating out 1000's of horse power, the average life expectancy was 5 years before over-haul, did they ever lose power, well nope. some engines injected the vapor into the exhaust, even some cars did that, but the cats stopped that. what little oil does make it to the cyl would be upper cyl lube, the reason i think my ch has nearly220k miles, burned 1qt/1k miles.
the issue is stupidity, you cannot beat a dead horse in standing up, so buy a new horse.
true there are tree huggers and go to the extreme but a properly designed engine within its service life poses zero threats, it is stupidity that makes people make mosquito sprayer out of them. it is like second hand smoke, keep it to yourself!!!
in cali, if you get flagged into DOT inspection bay, they will creeper under your truck and if you drop more than three drops of oil in x minutes, you will not go in, sooooooo if every one dropped oil, it would not be long, your ground water will be affected.
MOST of the vapor, you guessed it, WATER. you do know water injection is used to boost power even in fighter jets, so why is it harmful???
old 60's and back just dumped to the ground and epa and research data showed environmental issues. the issue is not the data but stupidity. if you ever lived in cali back before emission were put in place, it was smog city, so who hurts, everyone! ever drove into chicago??? 90 miles out, it looks like tires burning on the horizon!!!!
i worked on industrial engines for 47 years and they ran 24/7/365 full bore beating out 1000's of horse power, the average life expectancy was 5 years before over-haul, did they ever lose power, well nope. some engines injected the vapor into the exhaust, even some cars did that, but the cats stopped that. what little oil does make it to the cyl would be upper cyl lube, the reason i think my ch has nearly220k miles, burned 1qt/1k miles.
the issue is stupidity, you cannot beat a dead horse in standing up, so buy a new horse.
true there are tree huggers and go to the extreme but a properly designed engine within its service life poses zero threats, it is stupidity that makes people make mosquito sprayer out of them. it is like second hand smoke, keep it to yourself!!!
in cali, if you get flagged into DOT inspection bay, they will creeper under your truck and if you drop more than three drops of oil in x minutes, you will not go in, sooooooo if every one dropped oil, it would not be long, your ground water will be affected.
Like I always say, if you don't like the way I drive, stay the fk off the sidewalk.
Around these parts we take violating our civil liberties seriously. Detaining someone without probable cause is a violation of those rights. Your DOT inspection station wouldn't last long here. Laws are made by the people for the people. If CA wants !aws that allow the feds to interfere in their lives and stomp on their personal liberties, that's their call. Don't expect the rest of us to follow suit.
But then the people of CA probably don't have much of a choice given how deep they're into the feds being it's a bankrupt state and has been for quite some time. Of course laws that stifle the economy will do that.
Your oil burner that produces a whopping 57 hp is no example of these machines today, btw.
Last edited by 60Gunner; Jan 22, 2022 at 11:34 AM.
there are very few rights in the human chain, mostly privileges.
you do know, i have a right to punch you in the nose, BUT it ends the micro-second before contact!!!
forest gump once said "you cannot fix stupid" !
tree hugger i am not, the argument was is it detrimental!!!!
statement was "in a properly operating machine" , if your ride is carboning up, you have MORE issues than you choose to believe.
yep, do you want double butter with that?? mr. max
vasoline for his!
What are my rights vs CARB? Who cares. I live in Ilinois. Water injection for short field take offs. Absolutely. BUT the amount of water to cool intake tract so more boost and timing can come into play is not what we are getting with this oily mist we are putting into the intake tract of our Vtwins. You can state it is just water, but if it is just water. What is the problem with breather externally to atmoshere?
Best thing for performance is to breath externally outside of the engine. If one was worried about environment. Breath into a catch can. Adding more places for the engine to breath is not necessary on 99% of the engines out on the street. By just adding a hole into the fill cap can mess with engine vacuum and can hurt performance because of aerated oil and ring seal. Remember Fueling had a device when TC first came out. It flashed in the pan and no one needed it. Then it came back around with the M8's and all of a sudden it became the new rage and everyone has to have it now. M8's never sumped because of not enough volume in the breather passages to expel the needed air. They sump because of bad designed pumps, leaking piston jets and too little air volume in the oil tank that caused high pressure fluctuations.
If one had to have a hose on their filler cap. IMO it would be better to route it to a sealed closed container. This would give the air more volume over the oil in the tank, and would lower pressure fluctuations.
What are my rights vs CARB? Who cares. I live in Ilinois. Water injection for short field take offs. Absolutely. BUT the amount of water to cool intake tract so more boost and timing can come into play is not what we are getting with this oily mist we are putting into the intake tract of our Vtwins. You can state it is just water, but if it is just water. What is the problem with breather externally to atmoshere?
Best thing for performance is to breath externally outside of the engine. If one was worried about environment. Breath into a catch can. Adding more places for the engine to breath is not necessary on 99% of the engines out on the street. By just adding a hole into the fill cap can mess with engine vacuum and can hurt performance because of aerated oil and ring seal. Remember Fueling had a device when TC first came out. It flashed in the pan and no one needed it. Then it came back around with the M8's and all of a sudden it became the new rage and everyone has to have it now. M8's never sumped because of not enough volume in the breather passages to expel the needed air. They sump because of bad designed pumps, leaking piston jets and too little air volume in the oil tank that caused high pressure fluctuations.
If one had to have a hose on their filler cap. IMO it would be better to route it to a sealed closed container. This would give the air more volume over the oil in the tank, and would lower pressure fluctuations.
The sportster one on the other hand leaves a lot to be desired. It's a cheap plastic one piece housing that can't be opened or the actual valve replaced. The plastic housing is prone to warping under the high heat in the heads thus interfering with the valve opening and closing. I literally blew out 3 sets of rocker cover seals and had a head gasket weeping on the dyno due to excessive crankcase pressure before coming up with the above breather mod that worked great btw.
Bustert is also very much aware of the very extensive dyno testing Hammer Performance did that showed with absolute certainty a loss of 2-4 hp across the entire rpm range when venting into the intake. 100% of the time!! Literally hundreds of pulls were done on their test mule.
The carbon build up it causes as well as the lowering of the octane level is also very well documented. Both increase the risk of detonation.
If you live in the Republic of kAli, sucks to be you. But don't try justifying the stupidity of this practice by saying it's harmless or that the environment will be destroyed if one choses to fix this problem by venting to atmosphere. Way too much evidence says otherwise. Only brainwashed treehuggers believe this nonsense pedaled by the EPA.
I do think venting the twin cam from the cam chest would work just as well at the very least and have the added benefits if easy accessibility for cleaning and replacing as well as a cosmetic improvement by not having unsightly hoses dangling from the heads.
Besides the KVP38 which is a 3/8" breather valve, Hayden makes a 1/2" one, the KVP12. A reed valve would be better. They are pricier and do make noise tho. There are a number I've indentified both inline and hard mounted that I think might help keep a more consistent vacuum in the crankcase of the twin cam tho.
Last edited by 60Gunner; Jan 23, 2022 at 11:14 AM.
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