Tweakin' the VOES, upgrading the ignition...
Road Warrior
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 1,952
Likes: 15
From: Senoia, Ga., by way of Miami, Fl..
Front and rear cyl dont reach TDC at the same time. I'm guessing it would stagger the firing based on which cyl is on compression..
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Nov 2006
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From: la la land jerzey
so we chassed it on the dyno with the shops road race buell
after 2 hours on an engine that was due to be re done but had still finished podium we went after it - and found ONE HP and it was well over the top in RPMs of what normal engines run for street driving
i the idea has to do with the 45 degrees V Twin design AND single fire type ignition not duel fire that harley uses < BTW we had race motors that made more power duel fire than single fire -- anyway the idea was good but we never found what they were trying to sell except something no one else had --johnjzjz
Elite HDF Member
Joined: Sep 2007
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From: Bluffton, South Carolina
We found basically the same thing with the rear cylinder timing. There are some cams that you can gain 1-2 hp high up with it. Mostly we set the timing with the number one cylinder where we want it and then use it to set the rear to match.
John
John
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From: la la land jerzey
hey i forgot to say the acc pump needs to be just at the hesitant spot with that much static compression 185 pounds - if the acc pump is rich the excessive fuel entering the combustion chamber after a hot ride HWY SPEED, the fuel in hard droplets bounce around and cause knocking ( hydraulics ) - the roll on rattel is different issue and should sound different as well that is to much timing too soon --- and Voes retard as you might have to dial it back till you get it
It all needs to be done when your done adding stuff to the bike two of the 2 into one of the shops bikes the blue is a thunder header with a moded supertrap - the other is a kerker with a moded baffle
It all needs to be done when your done adding stuff to the bike two of the 2 into one of the shops bikes the blue is a thunder header with a moded supertrap - the other is a kerker with a moded baffle
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Road Warrior
Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 1,476
Likes: 5
From: Florida
There are none. I havent dinked with it yet. Its so slight and occasional that I am not too concerned. I'll wait until I get my 2-1 and ignition, then tweak it all. Actually, I retarded the timing a degree or two right after this thread and havent heard it since, but it did take some of the "snap" out of my acceleration.
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Joined: Sep 2012
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From: almost there
There are none. I havent dinked with it yet. Its so slight and occasional that I am not too concerned. I'll wait until I get my 2-1 and ignition, then tweak it all. Actually, I retarded the timing a degree or two right after this thread and havent heard it since, but it did take some of the "snap" out of my acceleration.
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Joe Kucinski
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Joined: Jan 2013
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From: Vermont
After reading your post I still think you can tame it, a faint rattle below 2500 is the problem area for most performance bikes. The rattle off idle is a heat soak condition and like JJZ is speaking of, gas is igniting before the spark from heat or hot spots on the piston, that is why flat tops work better. Timing will help in the below 2500 range but not off idle, got to get the cylinders cooled down or fighting a loosing battle.
Being at the edge, going to need tuning equipment be spot on, you are not far off but detonation can be evil to tune out. Next issue is don't dyno tune it if you are going to change exhaust soon, money wasted but make a decision because the rattle is caused by heat and heat will stick a piston so going to sugarcoat this, put some fuel to it dammit
try shimming that needle because it controls both cruise and roll on area, richening that area will help both throttle roll on and cruise which is where you are running when the idle rattle is an issue coming off cruise area as you mentioned.
That $160 on the Ultima is a good price but the coil is junk, got 1/2 season out of the coil but the module has been strong for several years, will help tame the midrange but not much help off idle as mentioned earler.
Something that happens when tuning is for every 1 degree of timing retard, richens AFR .1 so 10 degree retard richens AFR 1.0, noticed this from EFI tuning so a voes can pull detonation out of a problem area unless the AFR's are way out of bounds to start with.
Being at the edge, going to need tuning equipment be spot on, you are not far off but detonation can be evil to tune out. Next issue is don't dyno tune it if you are going to change exhaust soon, money wasted but make a decision because the rattle is caused by heat and heat will stick a piston so going to sugarcoat this, put some fuel to it dammit
try shimming that needle because it controls both cruise and roll on area, richening that area will help both throttle roll on and cruise which is where you are running when the idle rattle is an issue coming off cruise area as you mentioned.That $160 on the Ultima is a good price but the coil is junk, got 1/2 season out of the coil but the module has been strong for several years, will help tame the midrange but not much help off idle as mentioned earler.
Something that happens when tuning is for every 1 degree of timing retard, richens AFR .1 so 10 degree retard richens AFR 1.0, noticed this from EFI tuning so a voes can pull detonation out of a problem area unless the AFR's are way out of bounds to start with.
Wow I took a bunch of crap off this ole girl. Thanks