Cooler Running with 87 Octane???
Grand HDF Member
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 4,585
Likes: 673
From: Rolla
Found this on a Sunoco web site:
Why is Sunoco gasoline different from other brands of gasoline?
* Sunoco gasolines meet every car manufacturer's specifications for oxygenated and reformulated fuels in areas where those fuels are required by law.
* Sunoco gasolines do not contain methanol.
* In compliance with federal law and as stipulated by most automobile manufacturers, Sunoco gasolines contain no more than 10% ethanol.
Source: http://sunocoinc.com/Site/Consumer/R...olineFacts.htm
Now, it does seem that some stations do have Methanol. This one is in Canada though.
Sunoco service station at 4061 Sheppard Avenue East in Scarborough, Ont., for consumer vehicle consumption.
The methanol is available via a special dispensing unit and retail pump for self-service fuelling, alongside traditional gasoline fuel pumps.
Source: http://www.allbusiness.com/north-ame.../327316-1.html
So, looks like it comes down to this:
If the pump says Methanol - Do NOT pump it into your Harley
If it says Ethanol - Although some won't use it, Harley says it is ok.
Why is Sunoco gasoline different from other brands of gasoline?
* Sunoco gasolines meet every car manufacturer's specifications for oxygenated and reformulated fuels in areas where those fuels are required by law.
* Sunoco gasolines do not contain methanol.
* In compliance with federal law and as stipulated by most automobile manufacturers, Sunoco gasolines contain no more than 10% ethanol.
Source: http://sunocoinc.com/Site/Consumer/R...olineFacts.htm
Now, it does seem that some stations do have Methanol. This one is in Canada though.
Sunoco service station at 4061 Sheppard Avenue East in Scarborough, Ont., for consumer vehicle consumption.
The methanol is available via a special dispensing unit and retail pump for self-service fuelling, alongside traditional gasoline fuel pumps.
Source: http://www.allbusiness.com/north-ame.../327316-1.html
So, looks like it comes down to this:
If the pump says Methanol - Do NOT pump it into your Harley
If it says Ethanol - Although some won't use it, Harley says it is ok.
Road Warrior
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 1,807
Likes: 1
From: North Jersey
A lot of interesting debate here on the fuel/octane subject, but for me the manufacturer's recommendation trumps you all. The H-D manual specifically recommends 91 octane or higher. No matter what you think of the MoCo, they are the experts. Why mess around with theories?
Cruiser
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 203
Likes: 5
From:
Fact, any increase in octane over and above what the engine requires will make it run hotter, the reason being that a higher octane level does nothing more than make the gasoline burn slower. Any increase in power in an engine designed for, say 87 octane, that's being run on higher octane fuel is purely in the imagination of the operator.
Stellar HDF Member
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 2,137
Likes: 17
From:
Speaking of ethanol. I have many boater friends who are very concerned about winter storing with ethanol gas in the boats. They have been citing information they have read that shows that the big problem with ethanol is that it breaks down. The end result is internal corrosion.
Seems like most stations in my area are 10% ethanol.
With winter approaching, I would think this would be an issue for many on this forum also.
Anyone heard of this?
Seems like most stations in my area are 10% ethanol.
With winter approaching, I would think this would be an issue for many on this forum also.
Anyone heard of this?
Road Captain
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 662
Likes: 0
From: SE Michigan
Easy for us to run run the tank out and fill with non ethanol fuel. These guys not so much. Sea Foam and hope for the best.
Outstanding HDF Member
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 2,615
Likes: 31
From: Charlotte Area
OK not so fast. I checked my owners manual and it says 87 octane is recommended. I had beem running mid or premium until the fuel shortage because I just felt it would be better BUT the 87 runs just fine. Course I am ridng a 95 Ultra with an evo. When I save enough on gas to buy a new bike, I think I'll pay cash for it. Only 2 million more miles to go . LOL
Road Warrior
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 1,557
Likes: 6
From: Fort Lauderdale, Florida
Oil is just like any other commodity.
When the price of gold rises, is it because there's a shortage?
The trading price of commodities are influenced by the market. Certain lobbyist try and use these fluctuations to help instill fear into Americans so they vote to change legislature into allowing them to drill in places they currently are not allowed, such as Alaska.
We will be piloting flying saucers long before we run out of oil.
"Free America from dependence on foreign oil" is slang for "We want to make tons of money so we have to do whatever it takes to convince the US people to let us drill for oil in protected land. Because we don't care about the land, or the people, we just want that new Mercedes that we just saw in Motor Trend last month"
That's exactly what it means.
When the price of gold rises, is it because there's a shortage?
The trading price of commodities are influenced by the market. Certain lobbyist try and use these fluctuations to help instill fear into Americans so they vote to change legislature into allowing them to drill in places they currently are not allowed, such as Alaska.
We will be piloting flying saucers long before we run out of oil.
"Free America from dependence on foreign oil" is slang for "We want to make tons of money so we have to do whatever it takes to convince the US people to let us drill for oil in protected land. Because we don't care about the land, or the people, we just want that new Mercedes that we just saw in Motor Trend last month"
That's exactly what it means.
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Road Captain
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 516
Likes: 1
From: New Hampster!
The two real issues with Ethanol is one it has an affinity to water, meaning it will bind readily with water. This can be a good thing...AKA Dri-Gas. Problem being it can only bind with so much water. When it reaches the maximum capacity it has what is called phase seperation. In other words the ethanol/water mix phases out of the gasoline settling to the bottom, leaving behind a gasoline with a very low octane rating and an ethanol water mix, neither will burn easily if at all..
The other issue with Ethanol is it is a very strong solvent. Sloshing around in your fuel system will loosen and suspend any contaminents that have formed there over time. The problems we have in the marine industry are usually from older fiberglass tanks. The Ethanol actually degrades the resin that binds the older fiberglass. Newer resins have been determined Ethanol safe.
Newer fuel systems are not exactly always safe. Just replaced the fuel system in a '97 bike that had started leaking, fuel lines were found to be sticky and soft. Squeeze the line between your finger and thumb and it would flatten and stay stuck together. On a side note 10% Ethanol mix removes 10% of gasoline from every set volume and replaces it with 10% Ethanol (that has a lower BTU rating VS Gasoline) so you actually get less power per gallon of E10 than you do with straight gas. This will require you to 'give it more gas' to get the same performance and mileage will drop. (as a direct result of the BTU per gallon) Now do we bring up the whole issue of cetane ratings for diesel fuel?
The other issue with Ethanol is it is a very strong solvent. Sloshing around in your fuel system will loosen and suspend any contaminents that have formed there over time. The problems we have in the marine industry are usually from older fiberglass tanks. The Ethanol actually degrades the resin that binds the older fiberglass. Newer resins have been determined Ethanol safe.
Newer fuel systems are not exactly always safe. Just replaced the fuel system in a '97 bike that had started leaking, fuel lines were found to be sticky and soft. Squeeze the line between your finger and thumb and it would flatten and stay stuck together. On a side note 10% Ethanol mix removes 10% of gasoline from every set volume and replaces it with 10% Ethanol (that has a lower BTU rating VS Gasoline) so you actually get less power per gallon of E10 than you do with straight gas. This will require you to 'give it more gas' to get the same performance and mileage will drop. (as a direct result of the BTU per gallon) Now do we bring up the whole issue of cetane ratings for diesel fuel?
Last edited by Ultra110; Oct 6, 2008 at 08:44 PM.
Cruiser
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 176
Likes: 2
From: South Carolina
Octane rating enhancing substances slow the flame front, resulting in a controlled burn.
Combustion without being iniated by spark, is pre-ignition but still somewhat of a controlled burn and that's the pinging you hear. The danger is pre-ignition can lead to detonation which is the complete and spontaneous combustion of all the fuel, and that will destroy spark plugs, put holes in pistons and bend push rods...... and that's a bad thing.
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