Don't expect the best prices of the year during riding season. If the bottom line is most important to you, then buy off season.

There are up to 3 seperate transactions going on when you purchase a bike or car. You are buying a bike, you are obtaining financing (this is a big profit center for dealers) and you may be trading in a bike.

The dealers are going to want to combine the first to items by focusing on monthly payments, don't do this. Your payments will be determined by the price you pay for the bike, the term and interest rate of the loan. If you let them focus on monthly payments, they are playing with the financing to get you to your monthly payment goal, not the price of the bike.

Once you decide you on a price for the bike, you can then talk about financing options, which may be limited by your credit score. The best thing you can do is to walk in with financing already arranged. This gives you something to compare to what the dealer is offering. This is also the area you can save the most $$$ over the life of the loan so shop, shop, shop for your financing.

Good luck, have fun and enjoy your new ride.

 

Its a shame you can't do any of that around here. Dealers will charge $3k over list and won't budge a dime.

 

3k over MSRP plus freight, setup, doc fees, title fees, state-county-local taxes, ect? Or 3k over MSRP out the door?

3k over MSRP out the door and adding in all the above is way too much. Run, don't walk from those dealers.

 

Do not make the mistake of saying you have cash. Act poor. I never finance hobbies, but I never let on I am paying cash. If they know this you are not going to get a bottom dollar price. However if the salesman knows the finance man is going to add profit, he may be will to take your lower offer price. I do my homework and have some idea what dealer has paid. Remember, he must make a profit. This is how I do cars. However, when it comes to doing Harleys, I admit I have had no luck. Both times I have gotten what I thought was at least a MSRP of the bike and the two local dealers in my area are always couple 1000 above this plus all the taxes and stuff like on igenf 's pink worksheet. I just walked away, and they could not have cared less. I got my base price from the Harley site. I am not sure how you can actually get a true price of what the dealer paid to try and come up with a fair offer price.

igenf, I assume you are saying the MSRP for the worksheet bike was about 26K.. Did you make a finial offer of the base price 19203.40 and dealer took it? That is close to 6796.60 off if your MSRP is correct.

 

Cash or finance same to a dealer? Nah, not in my book. Cash talks. Went to byuy a sportster(used) from a dealer a few years ago and I knew what i wanted to pay for it. thats the cash i walked in with. They wanted like $2 G more than my number. After some desk top haggling and "referr to the sales manager" tactics I layed the cash on the table and "this is what i am willing to pay". They balked and I walked. they called me the next day and said they would acept my offer. course at this point I am an hour drive away and I asked for a little more to make it worth m time to drive back to their shop. got 5 K service and discounted 10K service voucher.
1. Never let them see you smile
2. Nver accept their first offer
3. Be ready to ask for more.
4. Do your homework and know what you want, and how much they are going to ask.

 

Take someone that knows about motorcycles with you who isn't emotionally invested in the purchase for objective support. Unless you're really set on buying new, check out the used market (not at a dealer) There are some very good VERY low mileage bikes out there. If you're buying new I wouldn't mention the trade in until you're done. Especially if you're financing, it just gives them more numbers to try to confuse you with and once you have your price, you'll have already done your homework and know what your trade is worth. Then it's "oh by the way, I decided to trade in my bike after all". They ARE trying to steal from you. Don't ever forget that. Lying to the salesman about your finances, trade in, alimony and child support payments you don't have or anything else is absolutely acceptable. The dealer nor the salesman cares about you no matter how much your spending or how nice they are. Get EVERYTHING in writing. Any extras, services etc. Once you sign, It's done.

 

MSRP - or price off the HD website is close to $26k on a 2012 new EG Ultra Limited

that price of $19203 was the discounted sale price, so yes in essence they offered over $6k off of the price of the bike - yes there is that much mark up on a limited equipped EG

at first we honestly thought they were low balling us and sending us packing - I went out into my car and called my local dealership in Stuart FL, we were up in Orlando with a buddy and this was his deal after being hit and totaling his old 2005 EG Ultra - I talked with my finance guy at my dealership, and he told me straight up, looking up the exact same bike in his own inventory (and they all pay the same) that $19203 was exactly a $900 deal to the dealership, that it was into the holdback, but it was still a $900 profit any way you slice it. He also said he would match it, but his would be two weeks to get the color, and then he also said, just to buy it there as there is no sense in waiting two weeks and driving down from Daytona (where my buddy lives) to Stuart and picking up a bike, when you can get one in Sanford, FL which is all of 20 mins from Daytona.

That worksheet is the ACTUAL buyers order from his deal - he paid cash, doesn't matter about the price of the bike

so October of 2012 we have a buddy looking for a good deal - call my finance guy in Stuart and ask, you still want to match that price from Seminole HD on a Limited, he says yep, and I even have the same color sitting in front of me - and we sold another one at the exact same price, less OTD though because the Sales Tax was different from both counties, so the second bike was a few bucks cheaper - and now I have two buddies on 2012 EG Ultra Limiteds that both saved over $6k off MSRP and were both OTD pricing in that $21,400 range

call it good timing, call it luck, call it good negotiations, whatever

there is THAT much mark up in these bikes

some things to remember here

1 - NO DEALER - not bikes, cars, none of them will ever sell things at a loss - it's just not worth it, if they say its a loss, then they are getting a rebate or something,

2 - dealers get holdback - this is money under the invoice cost of the unit - i.e. if MSRP is $25k and invoice is $20k - holdback is about $1k - so after they sell you the bike, even if they sell it to you what they own it for which is actually invoice cost $20k they get a check back from the manufacturer for $1k for floorplan - this is called holdback

3 - price is price, and that is how the front of the house (salesman, sales manager) gets paid - their profit above invoice is the price they work off, the more you pay, the better the deal for them

4 - finance has nothing to do with price - once you agree on price, finance gets going - the other post mentioned this - finance guys get paid on the back end of the deal - the bank, HD finance, whoever gets your loan bought at a certain rate - 6% say - the finance guy tells you, hey great news I got you this loan at 8% - then proceeds to talk about how hard it was because you were late paying certain bills - trust me they have your credit history in front of them - they see you were late on your mortgage or car payment, or have $15k in credit card debt - they see it all, so they make it seem like they did you a favor, meanwhile they are getting paid on the 2% upsell on the life of the loan, that can be a difference of $2-4k so they get that backend money

5 - go to a credit union, they are honest, they will approve you and there is ZERO hassle, you go in with a pre-approved paper and the finance guy can't do anything but match it, maybe they can do better and you can save some, but that is rare

6 - trades are another place where dealers make money, but that is a crap shoot, you really just need to have a number that you are happy getting and fight for that number - this should ALWAYS be after you negotiate for the new price - that way your numbers don't start to change

if you get $20k for a price, and then introduce the trade and you want $10k for your trade, then the difference should be $10k - yes it sounds simple, but so many people get lost in deals - in the end your bottom line should be $10k that is all you should care about after you negotiated the price of $20k and fought for a trade worth $10k

now, that $10k is always Plus tax, most likely a dealer fee and some fees - like tire and battery impact fees

Then you get your OTD - Out the Door price - which will be the total sum of money for the transaction, be it financed, cash, check, money order, credit union draft whatever that is the bottom line

I did this for a living in my early years and now I use my wealth of experience and knowledge to help my friends and others


let me also say this


THE DEALER DOES NOT HAVE TO SELL YOU A BIKE

if they don't want to deal, have limited inventory, new model, whatever, they can just say NO - they have the bike

that is why I have ALWAYS had more success with the big BIG dealers, the ones that have 5 copies of the one you just have to have - they want them gone, and to them they are just a UNIT

if you love your little store, and love the personal attention and all that BS, great for you, get the best deal you can, be happy on your new HOG

if you want the BEST deal, price, finance, trade in - your best chance for that is a big store - they may have 10 units the exact way you want it, and they are just as happy to move one at a very low profit to hit their numbers as they are to sell one to some sap who knows nothing about the negotiation and just has to have this ONE

oh and one last thing - the end of the month means nothing

guess what happens when you turn the calendar - a new month starts, which means they want to sell you a bike on the 1st of the month, just as badly as they do on the 30th - they have numbers to get to, quotas, each salesman has a bonus to get to based on a certain number of units out the door, the sales manager has a bonus based on total units out the door, so it doesn't matter if you are on the 10th, 15th, 20th or 30th day of the month, they need that sale.

In fact I have been in a dealership that wasn't close to hitting total numbers for the month and then sacked the sales until the next month to get a good start on the next month, because they KNEW they couldn't hit bonus for the month they were in, and wanted to sack the sales and get a better shot at the following month's bonus

hope all this info helps -

 

At least 3 over+ TTT. Won't say a name, but they are in Hampton, Virginia Beach and Portsmouth. Have not and will not buy a bike at either. To many people will pay the price here, and smile while getting bent over.

 

Now that sounds like excellent advice. Thanks for the lesson.

 

I'm on the other side of the creek..who I was talking about above in post 34. Guess I should have felt pretty good at 2K over. Guess he had a tube of KY that day. The one on your side worked on the primary in my bike twice and failed to fix the alternator rotor spline that was totally gone and the one on this side failed the third time it was opened up trying to figure what the problem was.