Charging system still
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Cruiser
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 200
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From: Assonet MA
Charging system still
74 XLH. Not only am I not charging I am drawing on the battery. I put a test light between the negative post of the battery and the neg cable and I light it up when I trun the key on. Every thing seems to be working except of course the charging. Generator idiot light is not on the bike. I do have an Amp Meter. Sits flat while bike is running. No movement on revs. but when I hit the lights it drops like it should. I disconnected everything at the terminal board wire by wire \\;and then under the seat at breakers \\;trying to find the bad circuit but nothing shut the light off.
Any suggestions? Am I missing something?
Recently replaced the regulator but honestly had something not right prior.
 \\;
Any suggestions? Am I missing something?
Recently replaced the regulator but honestly had something not right prior.
 \\;
Stellar HDF Member
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 3,035
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From: Houston Texas
RE: Charging system still
I put a test light between the negative post of the battery and the neg cable and I light it up when I trun the key on.
Now wait a minute here......
Are you saying that you have disconnected the negative cable at the battery post, put one lead of a test light on the (-) battery post and the other lead on the disconnected battery ground cable and the light lights up when you turn on the key?
I do not think this is much of a legit test myself. When you turn on the key the electrical circuit is seeking to find a ground. It does this by going through the test light? I do not think so. You would be better off to test the ground cable for continuity.
I think your problem lies elsewhere myself.................pg
Now wait a minute here......
Are you saying that you have disconnected the negative cable at the battery post, put one lead of a test light on the (-) battery post and the other lead on the disconnected battery ground cable and the light lights up when you turn on the key?
I do not think this is much of a legit test myself. When you turn on the key the electrical circuit is seeking to find a ground. It does this by going through the test light? I do not think so. You would be better off to test the ground cable for continuity.
I think your problem lies elsewhere myself.................pg
Thread Starter
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Cruiser
Joined: Jun 2008
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From: Assonet MA
RE: Charging system still
that is what I have. I thought that was a pretty standard test when you suspect crossed wire somewhere. \\; Does it make sense for it \\;to lite it up the way it is? The ground strap is wide flat braided thing. Seems fine. I have buzzed out the wires from the generator to the regulator and they seem in order. The gen. light is not there and I have to believe the wire to it is just cut back somewhere.
I picked this bike up late last year. Ran her a few times and never had trouble starting. She sat for a bit over the winter. When I began working on it I had starting problems, I figured a tired battery. Battery seemed OK but I picked up a new one so I would know for sure I was staring with a good unit. She starts fine with a full charge, say 12.3 to 12.6 volts. Less than that needs a jump.
Batterty is not charging. I opened the generator and found a brush spring jammed. Thought I had it, but no luck. Still the same. Is there a way to test the genarator other than the set up with the in line amp meter.
I picked this bike up late last year. Ran her a few times and never had trouble starting. She sat for a bit over the winter. When I began working on it I had starting problems, I figured a tired battery. Battery seemed OK but I picked up a new one so I would know for sure I was staring with a good unit. She starts fine with a full charge, say 12.3 to 12.6 volts. Less than that needs a jump.
Batterty is not charging. I opened the generator and found a brush spring jammed. Thought I had it, but no luck. Still the same. Is there a way to test the genarator other than the set up with the in line amp meter.
Stellar HDF Member
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 3,035
Likes: 17
From: Houston Texas
RE: Charging system still
The gen. light is not there and I have to believe the wire to it is just cut back somewhere.
If that wire has been cut back somewhere and is hitting a ground, the generator will not charge.
The original wire on a 1974 XLH was tan in color. This wire ran from the 'GEN' terminal on the voltage regulator to the generator signal light. You can see where should the wire be grounded somewhere, then the generator would charge to ground, or better said.....would not put out a charge.
Is there a way to test the genarator other than the set up with the in line amp meter.
Not that I know of.The trouble is in the charging circuit which consists of the generator, regulator, the associated wiring, and the battery. Your battery is not the problem, so that leaves the generator, regulator and the wiring.
I would look for that missing gen signal light first and make sure it is not there touching ground somewhere. The easy way is to look at the GEN terminal on the regulator. Is the wire there?
This terminal should have 2 tan wires connected to it. One goes to the generator 'A' terminal. Leave that one connected. The other tan wire will be going to that signal light you do not have installed. Remove this wire. Now start it up and see if it charges.
If not, then the generator is the next place you need to check. The regulator is the last thing to check........pg
If that wire has been cut back somewhere and is hitting a ground, the generator will not charge.
The original wire on a 1974 XLH was tan in color. This wire ran from the 'GEN' terminal on the voltage regulator to the generator signal light. You can see where should the wire be grounded somewhere, then the generator would charge to ground, or better said.....would not put out a charge.
Is there a way to test the genarator other than the set up with the in line amp meter.
Not that I know of.The trouble is in the charging circuit which consists of the generator, regulator, the associated wiring, and the battery. Your battery is not the problem, so that leaves the generator, regulator and the wiring.
I would look for that missing gen signal light first and make sure it is not there touching ground somewhere. The easy way is to look at the GEN terminal on the regulator. Is the wire there?
This terminal should have 2 tan wires connected to it. One goes to the generator 'A' terminal. Leave that one connected. The other tan wire will be going to that signal light you do not have installed. Remove this wire. Now start it up and see if it charges.
If not, then the generator is the next place you need to check. The regulator is the last thing to check........pg
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Dec 2004
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From: Texas! Ya mean there's someplace else?
RE: Charging system still
Out of curiosity - have you disconnected any wires from the generator?
If so, did you then flash the field before running the bike again?
A light connected to the neg battery terminal as you did should come on when the switch is turned on.
Turning the switch on can possibly complete several circuits - if points are closed, or if condenser is going bad, \\; a circuit \\; to ground can be made.
I've seen a bad regulator drain a battery, but that does not need the switch to be on.
Enough carbon buildup in the generator, or grounded field and/or armature windings can cause a ground also.
Here's a generator test procedure that will usually help isolate the problem, but it's not perfect.
GENERATOR TESTING
Ideal volts to battery - kick is 13-13.5vdc while electric is 14-14.5vdc.
Always polarize generator - Do not forget to flash the field whenever you unhook any leads on the generator.
Touch the positive battery terminal to the A terminal on the generator by briefly shorting the BAT to GEN terminals on a Delco regulator or B+ to D+ terminal on a Bosch regulator.
Never touch the F or DF terminals!
If you have the solid state regulator, flash the field by touching the positive battery terminal directly to the generator A terminal.
If generator is mounted with terminals on top, the A terminal is the front one.
Normal running - If you get above 15vdc to battery, the regulator is bad.
Gen output test - disconnect wires A and F at gen.
Meter negative lead to ground, positive lead to A terminal.
Should read 2-2.5vdc @ 2000rpm.
If not - repair generator.
Full field test - disconnect wires A and F and connect meter as above.
Ground F term to frame for 10 seconds maximum.
Should read 25-30vdc @ 2000rpm.
If not - repair generator.
If both above tests ok - regulator is bad, or the wiring to it.
Remember, battery must be fully charged for checking volts to it.
If in doubt - polarize again!
If so, did you then flash the field before running the bike again?
A light connected to the neg battery terminal as you did should come on when the switch is turned on.
Turning the switch on can possibly complete several circuits - if points are closed, or if condenser is going bad, \\; a circuit \\; to ground can be made.
I've seen a bad regulator drain a battery, but that does not need the switch to be on.
Enough carbon buildup in the generator, or grounded field and/or armature windings can cause a ground also.
Here's a generator test procedure that will usually help isolate the problem, but it's not perfect.
GENERATOR TESTING
Ideal volts to battery - kick is 13-13.5vdc while electric is 14-14.5vdc.
Always polarize generator - Do not forget to flash the field whenever you unhook any leads on the generator.
Touch the positive battery terminal to the A terminal on the generator by briefly shorting the BAT to GEN terminals on a Delco regulator or B+ to D+ terminal on a Bosch regulator.
Never touch the F or DF terminals!
If you have the solid state regulator, flash the field by touching the positive battery terminal directly to the generator A terminal.
If generator is mounted with terminals on top, the A terminal is the front one.
Normal running - If you get above 15vdc to battery, the regulator is bad.
Gen output test - disconnect wires A and F at gen.
Meter negative lead to ground, positive lead to A terminal.
Should read 2-2.5vdc @ 2000rpm.
If not - repair generator.
Full field test - disconnect wires A and F and connect meter as above.
Ground F term to frame for 10 seconds maximum.
Should read 25-30vdc @ 2000rpm.
If not - repair generator.
If both above tests ok - regulator is bad, or the wiring to it.
Remember, battery must be fully charged for checking volts to it.
If in doubt - polarize again!
Thread Starter
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Cruiser
Joined: Jun 2008
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From: Assonet MA
RE: Charging system still
I have that second tan wire and it is connected to a blue wire going into the main harness that runs into the the frame. I'm sure I disconneted it today with no change but I will try again tomorrow to be sure. Let you know what happens. I really do appreciate your help. Been years since I worked on one of these guys and wireing has never been a strong point of mine.
I look at the schematic and see only 6 wires in the charging system. I figure its got to be easy, but my struggle continues.
I look at the schematic and see only 6 wires in the charging system. I figure its got to be easy, but my struggle continues.
Thread Starter
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Cruiser
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 200
Likes: 39
From: Assonet MA
RE: Charging system still
I have remembered to flash it every time I fool with it.
I will run generator tests tomorrow and see how it goes. its getting the best of me right now. Every time I find something to fix and think I have it it leads me to something else.
Thanks.
I will run generator tests tomorrow and see how it goes. its getting the best of me right now. Every time I find something to fix and think I have it it leads me to something else.
Thanks.
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Thread Starter
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Cruiser
Joined: Jun 2008
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From: Assonet MA
RE: Charging system still
I cut back the wire to the generator light and it made no differance.
I did \\;the system test. Where I should have 10 DC amps I have 2.5.
Sounds like the generator, Yes?
I did \\;the system test. Where I should have 10 DC amps I have 2.5.
Sounds like the generator, Yes?
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Stellar HDF Member
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 3,035
Likes: 17
From: Houston Texas
RE: Charging system still
Yes it does sound like the generator is at fault. Have you looked at the generators brushes?
If the brushes look like they are good, inspect how they ride on the commutator. Both brushes have to be in full solid contact.
The other possibility of course is an either open or shorted armature, or the field coils are bad.
The manual tells you how to do all the test on the generator parts and you should be able to do all of these except those that require you have a growler (I am sure you do not)
I am hoping you find a problem with the brushes as this is the easiest to fix.........pg
If the brushes look like they are good, inspect how they ride on the commutator. Both brushes have to be in full solid contact.
The other possibility of course is an either open or shorted armature, or the field coils are bad.
The manual tells you how to do all the test on the generator parts and you should be able to do all of these except those that require you have a growler (I am sure you do not)
I am hoping you find a problem with the brushes as this is the easiest to fix.........pg
Thread Starter
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Cruiser
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 200
Likes: 39
From: Assonet MA
RE: Charging system still
Actually I thought I had. I opened it while it was still on the bike to take a look and found one brush stuck. Spring was jammed. Thought I was done after replacing the spring but no luck.
I will get at the other tests and let you know how I make out.
Thanks for your help.
I will get at the other tests and let you know how I make out.
Thanks for your help.