Maybe. And I am not addressing the question, so don't shoot me. But my opinion is historically (including me) people spent thousands getting a 3% to 4% increase in torque. From all of the very useful posts it seems like people are getting 3% to 4% increase in torque on the M8 with a moderate change to the bike that will make it not EPA compliant. With more money you can get 8% to 10% improvement. I believe even Jamie has clearly stated that some of their products (but not all) are not EPA compliant. So it comes down to personal preference. If a 3% to 4% improvement is important to someone, go for it (and please post videos). But for me my M8 is stage 1 using all HD product just because that was all that was available at the time. Plenty of torque (way more than my old twin cam). But to be honest the SE street cannons really came alive after about 700 miles and I have heard they will continue to get louder and deeper. For me I am happy. But I think I am getting old. I love the HD sound but waking all my neighbors at 5am when I go to work no longer interests me.

 

Its really easy to tell if its been modified. imagine your computer. cant you tell the last time a file was updated? If the mapping date does not match the last recorded flash date, they know its been modified. The tech is not hard at all. Now the question is will the dealer actually look this up? probably not depending on the dealer would be my guess.

 

But of course my dealer says they can ... thus creating the "captive market" :>(

 

Here's a question: When we talk about "flashing the ECM" are we replacing all of the code in the ECM, or just re-writing the fuel values? The reason I ask is because if it is the latter, then it is very possible for HD to have a counter in there that keeps track of how many times those values have been rewritten. However, either way I would assume with today's technology that it is very possible for HD to have a way to detect if the ECM has been flashed since leaving the factory. Whether that technology is in place and in use is debatable.

 

A dealer can see it has been flashed, but if it's been flashed back to stock, then I don't see how they can deny a warranty claim. I think I'm gonna go with the PV and Hi Rollers from Fuel Moto

 

Well if they can see it's been flashed back to stock, what would the answer be as to why it was flashed to begin with? I'm guessing you need to have a SEST to flash it with to have an EPA friendly tune that you can throw on it for warranty work rather than flashing it back to stock.

 

I don't think the issue is that they can tell its been flashed. I absolutely believe that they can determine that. The issue is will the dealer snitch on you. LOL

 

Well, one thing for sure. If someone gets a warranty claim denied we'll hear about it here...

 

This is the truth

 

In most cases, those custom tunes can be deleted and removed from the tuner. Unless you are uploading a totally new map file, most maps/tunes are copies of the baseline stock map. Obviously walking into an HD shop with the new tune will be evident once they log into the tuner. But if you flash back to stock, you will need to remove any other modified tune listed in its database if you don't want to get into a difficult position with your local dealer, or HQ who will have final say so on any and all warranty repairs.

The evidence left behind, and stored in your tuner's database, is what gives you away.

All of these tuners store history of tunes for reference and/or future use. You need to clean them out.

Now as for warranty coverage there is a US Federal Law which deals with consumer warranty coverage. It defines responsibilities for both the buyer and the seller of all consumer goods. A portion of this law applies to after market parts and modifications and how it affects your vehicle warranty.

The law basically states that you have a right to use after market, non-OEM parts on your vehicle and still retain the factory warranty. However, if there is a failure and the manufacturer can show that the failure was caused by the aftermarket part, they can deny coverage. Your dealer has to prove your aftermarket part caused the issue directly. They can't deny coverage on an electrical wiring issue just because you swapped exhaust pipes or changed the shocks, unless of course, the installation of those items somehow nicked the wires and caused a short. They will need to prove this.

But if you do swap out the exhaust, shocks, etc that particular piece will void coverage but only on those areas. In other words, you can't install new shocks, and then bring the bike in to report a wobble or unsteady suspension and expect them to fix it under warranty. I'm sure they'll fix it but you will be charged. In this scenario, the rest of the vehicle is still covered under the normal warranty.

Under the federal law the dealer must prove that after market equipment caused the need for repairs before they can deny warranty coverage. If they cannot prove such claim it is your legal right to demand compliance with the warranty.