Thinking about buying this kit. Its discontinued, but I was wondering if anybody has it and could give me performance results with it. Is it worth it?

 

Here's my experience...

Cams are about $300 on average... and without getting into a different head configuration to allow for high lift, are generally about 5 h.p. They do change your torque curve, however. The 203 cams provide more crusing range torque. The air cleaner and a set of pipes along with a tuner (on e.f.i. bikes) are worth 10 to 15 h.p. You would just change the jets and/or maybe the slide needle on a carb. Without labor and special tools figured in (changing the cams is much easier with JIMS tools). The bigger bore is important for more torque and h.p. but how much is dependent upon having the correct combination of fuel mixture and flow (efi ecm or carb work, air cleaner, and exhaust).

To make the whole shebang 'worth it' you need to talk to a tuner you trust that has used a stage II kit and find out what to do about the fuel flow and then get the bike dyno'd. If you are doing the work and shopping on ebay and you know someone you can borrow the tools from, you pay to bore the jugs and put all of this stuff in the bike plus get it dyno'd you're talking say 20.h.p. for say $1400 carbureted and $2400 with an autotune ecm. $70 to $120 per h.p. Throw out the dyno, ignore the advice of a tuner and get what you think looks good and sounds good... that changes the range to 15 h.p. for $1100 to $2100... or $73 to $140 per h.p. Funny how that works, eh?

P.S. I don't sell advice or dyno's... so this advice is free (and you get what you pay for, which is evident in the above numbers too). There are probably at least $300 worth of 'incidental's not in that number above (cam bearing upgrades, for example, lifters, etc.) so add $15 per h.p.. You can buy a new engine from S&S for what... $7500 and you get um.... an extra 60 h.p. over stock for about $123 per h.p. A warranted, rebuilt engine to stock specs from HD is about $58 per h.p. and another 100k miles or so.

If you add in someone else's labor, then the bucks go way through the roof.

My numbers are shot from the hip without a lot of current research but from some experience.

They won't change enough to make the point I'm making invalid... 'where Harley's are concerned, "worth it" is a highly subjective and almost pointless question.'

I would recommend that you invest in a hydraulic cam chain tensioner setup and some 204 cams... about $1100 and 5 h.p. but a lot of peace of mind and mileage with the new tensioner set up. The 204 torque range starts a little earlier and goes a little further than the 203... and sounds badder than the 203. I'm assuming you already have pipes and an air cleaner. There are also a number of different cams that have the same lift as the 204 but with different overlap and ramps so check around and talk to the manufacturers. Most important, figure out what it is you really use your bike for and what it is you want it to do because it won't do everything that you can imagine or ask for... except maybe spend your money for you and make a good hobby.

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I think the PN you made refernce to has been replaced by PN29859-04A; Stage II 95" kit.

A couple of things for you to consider. First, you will see more than a 5HP gain from the kit but replacing the 203 cams with the 204s is a good suggestion. I also assume that you have done Stage I, pipes and air filter upgrades and a Stage I TC88, with a tune, will make 89TQ/70HP, in round numbers. The Stage II package will make 90TQ/85HP; I have done it with a chitty set of pipes so a decent pipe would pick up a couple. Add street ported heads and you will see 100+TQ/90+HP.

The potential downside of the Stage II kit is that the pistons and cylinders are not "matched" components. So, you could get a set of pistons on the low end of the spec and a set of cylinders on the high end of the spec and you have fitment problems from the jump. Some dealers will put the cylinders in torque plates, check fitment prior to installation and if out of spec; they will send the parts back for some that will allow proper piston to cylnder fitment. Some dealers just bolt them together without checking. So, if you are planning on buying the kit, talk to the dealer first to see if they check fitment in torque plates.

A cheaper alternative is to have your cylnders bored and fitted to a new set of pistons. We have two forum sponsors (Hillside and VeeTwing Performance) that will do that for you on an exchange basis for a reasonable price and you can rest assured that the work is done properly.

The SE Hybrid cam plate/tensioner upgrade is worth the money if for no other reason than the upgraded oil pump. However, you can replace your tensioners wtih better ones from CYCO and eliminate the worry factor. The difference is one way will cost about $400 and the other about $50; a personal choice.

 

Thanks for the info!!

http://www.harleydavidsontensioner.com/

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The cam by itself is worth 5 hp. The kit is worth about 15. The kit plus the a/c and pipes should be around 20 hp. Sorry if I didn't state that clearly. I don't believe that the kit comes with new jugs but instead comes with the 203 cam but I don't have a catalog that goes back that far any more... I threw in some bucks for boring out the existing jugs. If it does come with jugs but not the cam, then add a couple bills.

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