After Stage 1, bike running HOT...
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Joined: Jun 2012
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From: Pittsburgh, PA
After Stage 1, bike running HOT...
OK before I go back to the dealer I thought I'd run it by you folks...
Bike is a '13 Slim.
I just had it into the dealer for a Stage 1 upgrade and at the same time I had the 1K service done (all synthetics).
The Stage 1 consisted of a set of V&H Big Shots, and S&S Super A/C, plus I purchased the SERT which they say they used to download a new map.
Now my understanding is (and they told me this beforehand as well), that the new map is of the "canned" variety but it would in fact enrich the fuel/air ratio somewhat, resulting in a little more power and cooler running.
The bike runs great, so no complaints there.
But I will say that if there was any increase in power as a result of this work, it's negligible.
I've seen people say how their machines felt "like a new bike" after tuning.
This one runs and feels pretty much like it did before all this - just louder.
Now... since I got it back, I've run three tanks of gas through it, and noticed two things:
#1) It's running considerably hotter that it was before (noticeable mainly in stop-n-go traffic) - so much so that I'm now worried about what this may do to the bike if left as is.
And this was on a few 70° days, I can't imagine how hot this will feel in summer.
#2) My MPG has jumped considerably, by 4MPG.
I know because I keep meticulous records, to the point where I enter gas receipts into an Excel spreadsheet.
So clearly the bike is still running lean, maybe even more now than before.
I'm assuming this is NOT normal. If anything I would have expected my MPG to drop a little.
So what can I expect, or ask the dealer to do to correct this?
On a side note, since I have the SERT, can I go ahead and buy the cables and software and play with this myself - or am I forever stuck at the dealer's mercy?
IOW, do they use any special dongles or equipment to make changes that I can't?
Bike is a '13 Slim.
I just had it into the dealer for a Stage 1 upgrade and at the same time I had the 1K service done (all synthetics).
The Stage 1 consisted of a set of V&H Big Shots, and S&S Super A/C, plus I purchased the SERT which they say they used to download a new map.
Now my understanding is (and they told me this beforehand as well), that the new map is of the "canned" variety but it would in fact enrich the fuel/air ratio somewhat, resulting in a little more power and cooler running.
The bike runs great, so no complaints there.
But I will say that if there was any increase in power as a result of this work, it's negligible.
I've seen people say how their machines felt "like a new bike" after tuning.
This one runs and feels pretty much like it did before all this - just louder.
Now... since I got it back, I've run three tanks of gas through it, and noticed two things:
#1) It's running considerably hotter that it was before (noticeable mainly in stop-n-go traffic) - so much so that I'm now worried about what this may do to the bike if left as is.
And this was on a few 70° days, I can't imagine how hot this will feel in summer.
#2) My MPG has jumped considerably, by 4MPG.
I know because I keep meticulous records, to the point where I enter gas receipts into an Excel spreadsheet.
So clearly the bike is still running lean, maybe even more now than before.
I'm assuming this is NOT normal. If anything I would have expected my MPG to drop a little.
So what can I expect, or ask the dealer to do to correct this?
On a side note, since I have the SERT, can I go ahead and buy the cables and software and play with this myself - or am I forever stuck at the dealer's mercy?
IOW, do they use any special dongles or equipment to make changes that I can't?
Last edited by jam436; Apr 10, 2013 at 07:51 AM.
Road Captain
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 632
Likes: 3
From: Virginia raised, stationed in Alaska
yep running lean.
not too sure about the tuning aspect of the sert.
I went with the PV and the Fuel MOto loaded tune was the same as what you described. It wasn't until i sent it back and forth to jamie and had him fine tune my logs that it really improved.
You may want to get that tuned right.
Pull ur o2 sensors and see if its white.
not too sure about the tuning aspect of the sert.
I went with the PV and the Fuel MOto loaded tune was the same as what you described. It wasn't until i sent it back and forth to jamie and had him fine tune my logs that it really improved.
You may want to get that tuned right.
Pull ur o2 sensors and see if its white.
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 7,651
Likes: 4,891
From: Missouri City,TX
I have the SE Pro Super Tuner on my Heritage and I "think" you can buy the cables and software, but why spend the extra $$$ to "play with it" when you all ready paid for the tune at the dealer?
FWIW, I also had the SE Pro Tuner on my '09 Street Bob and I had to bring it back to the dealer three times for them to make adjustments on the Dyno to get it right. They didn't charge me extra cuz I paid for the Dyno tuning up front when it was installed by them.
FWIW, I also had the SE Pro Tuner on my '09 Street Bob and I had to bring it back to the dealer three times for them to make adjustments on the Dyno to get it right. They didn't charge me extra cuz I paid for the Dyno tuning up front when it was installed by them.
Outstanding HDF Member
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 3,492
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From: Illinois
1, Did you get it Dyno'd after your changes? I just made this comment in another thread a few days ago. I have seen so many guys change up their bikes and skip the Dyno because of cost. NOTHING beats a Dyno tune, NOTHING! I am NOT a big fan of these auto tunes either. Maybe their fine after a Dyno but never to replace that. If you did get it Dyno tuned then I am stumped. 2, I never ever go to a dealership for anything unless it's for part's. I guess if one has to for warrant purposes then I guess your stuck but I would be looking for a good INDY regardless. Stealership's make me want to puke!
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From: Pittsburgh, PA
That and the dealer (in a moment of honesty) pulled me aside and told me it wasn't really necessary until I get to Stage 2, if I do.
The key word here being necessary.
I know, I know... I realize this is like opening a can of worms, like getting into a discussion about oil - a lot of strong opinions either way.
I realize a dyno tune is the best way, but they told me that if it was properly tuned at Stage 1, that I should see noticeable performance improvement, enough so that the added benefits from a dyno -might- not be worth the extra money - considering in my case that it was just a fine tuning on an otherwise stock engine.
They went on to say that dynos mainly benefited people who have had significant engine work done (at least cams).
He told me to save my money.
..and this was from a dealer I trust, whose main purpose is to make money...
Think about that - they had two choices here, [1] to either play me for a sucker, or [2] tell me straight up.
I believe they opted for door #2.
We'll see, after all, they did offer to make adjustments if needed.
I'm mainly just wondering if my initial results are typical...
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Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 3,078
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From: Michigan
1, Did you get it Dyno'd after your changes? I just made this comment in another thread a few days ago. I have seen so many guys change up their bikes and skip the Dyno because of cost. NOTHING beats a Dyno tune, NOTHING! I am NOT a big fan of these auto tunes either. Maybe their fine after a Dyno but never to replace that. If you did get it Dyno tuned then I am stumped. 2, I never ever go to a dealership for anything unless it's for part's. I guess if one has to for warrant purposes then I guess your stuck but I would be looking for a good INDY regardless. Stealership's make me want to puke!
The canned map only get's you close, however even with the dynotune, the stage one didn't impress me all that much having come from a 88" stroked evo and a 96" S&S evo, both put my 103 twinkie to shame. If you want to wake that motor up, get the heads done and throw cams in it, when it's breathing properly it will run properly
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Outstanding HDF Member
Joined: Oct 2011
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From: Illinois
You already answered your own questions in your original post, negligible gain in power and running hot. That in and of itself would send me running to a good Dyno guy. You have no idea the damage a wrongly tuned bike can do over time, even if you can't feel the effects in the seat of your pant's. I also might add the dealer's got you coming back, KaChing $$$$$$ or at least thinking about it, don't they? I DO NOT care what a Dealer says, you CAN NOT replace a Dyno after you have messed with the air intake and exhaust, period! Can and will it run? Sure! Will it run hot and lose power without it, yes it will. Which of the 2 are most hazardous to your bike motor? Dyno or not? Well, I guess that can only be left up to you. Should you Dyno it, watch the power gain and the heat of your engine change. I have a ton of motor work and I am changing my pipes as we speak. When it's done it is going straight to my Dyno guy, despite the work done on my motor it would go anyway. It's your bike and your money but consider this. A dealership's money is not made in bike sales. It's made in their shop and part's sales and on how many times they can get your bike, my bike and every one's else s bike back in the garage. In riding close to 40 years I have had few and far between positive outcomes with them. If I bought a brand spanking new bike I would still opt for an INDY rather than a dealership's shop, even at the risk of voiding my warranty. That's just me, it's how I roll! LOL.
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Joined: Sep 2012
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From: Los Angeles
Can't you download more than one map via the SERT? If so, they did the wrong map and maybe need to do you another -- free of charge.
I would investigate FL-ViEDs as well. Search here on the forum all about them. That's what I have running on my Slim and it's running great. Significant cool down, richer running, bike is smooth and quick off the line. You really can notice it. Cost a little over 100 bucks and you do a very easy install.
I was quoted 800 bucks for a dyno in L.A. That ain't chicken feed for a few extra HP.
I would investigate FL-ViEDs as well. Search here on the forum all about them. That's what I have running on my Slim and it's running great. Significant cool down, richer running, bike is smooth and quick off the line. You really can notice it. Cost a little over 100 bucks and you do a very easy install.
I was quoted 800 bucks for a dyno in L.A. That ain't chicken feed for a few extra HP.
Last edited by SoCalSoftailSlim; Apr 10, 2013 at 10:48 AM.