Stage 1 = tuner question
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Elite HDF Member
Joined: Nov 2012
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From: Phoenix, AZ
Stage 1 = tuner question
We all know about Xied's and the ECM download from HD but this question/post is not referring to those options.
Many have stated to get the best results from a Stage 1 upgrade is to use a Tuner, some have even said putting the bike on a dyno along with the tuner is a step further in the attempt to get the motor running at its optimal performance. Now, depending on who you speak too Tuner brand selection can vary and of course so does the dollar amount needed to obtain the Tuner and then there is an additional charge of paying for dyno time.
This brings me to my question, If I am only doing the Stage 1 and don't believe I will ever venture into the Stage 2, 3, etc. Would the Fuelpak by Vance and Hines be a fair choice for a Tuner, being that my setup has already been tested, dyno'ed and Mapped for use with their Tuner???
Plug-n-Play is a great thing for some of us that don't fully understand what goes into a motor tune or even know how to perform one..
Many have stated to get the best results from a Stage 1 upgrade is to use a Tuner, some have even said putting the bike on a dyno along with the tuner is a step further in the attempt to get the motor running at its optimal performance. Now, depending on who you speak too Tuner brand selection can vary and of course so does the dollar amount needed to obtain the Tuner and then there is an additional charge of paying for dyno time.
This brings me to my question, If I am only doing the Stage 1 and don't believe I will ever venture into the Stage 2, 3, etc. Would the Fuelpak by Vance and Hines be a fair choice for a Tuner, being that my setup has already been tested, dyno'ed and Mapped for use with their Tuner???
Plug-n-Play is a great thing for some of us that don't fully understand what goes into a motor tune or even know how to perform one..
Road Warrior
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 1,372
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From: In the foothills of southwestern NC - US of A
Hey ib5150, could you please clarify something in regards to your question?
"If I am only doing the Stage 1 and don't believe I will ever venture into the Stage 2, 3, etc. Would the Fuelpak by Vance and Hines be a fair choice for a Tuner, being that my setup has already been tested, dyno'ed and Mapped for use with their Tuner???"
Are you now questioning your choice of tuner, asking us our opinion of the V&H Fuel Pak, or both, or?
I think once the question is a little clearer [maybe I'm extra dense this morning I 'dunno, LOL] someone will provide an answer in return; as for me? Sheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeit, I'm not even going to get into the debate if that's the question this time, hahahahahahaha!!
=8^)
"If I am only doing the Stage 1 and don't believe I will ever venture into the Stage 2, 3, etc. Would the Fuelpak by Vance and Hines be a fair choice for a Tuner, being that my setup has already been tested, dyno'ed and Mapped for use with their Tuner???"
Are you now questioning your choice of tuner, asking us our opinion of the V&H Fuel Pak, or both, or?
I think once the question is a little clearer [maybe I'm extra dense this morning I 'dunno, LOL] someone will provide an answer in return; as for me? Sheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeit, I'm not even going to get into the debate if that's the question this time, hahahahahahaha!!
=8^)
Banned
Joined: Oct 2012
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Just a though from a performance oriented shop:
If you are looking to save $ then options as the Fuelpak would certainly have to be considered. Fuel management systems as these are less expensive. They piggyback the ECM/ECU and these companies have made great effort to come up with maps for all kinds of scenarios regarding mods. They will likely be able to get your bike tuned close enough that most riders would not know that their bike could perform better. The most popular of these brands do most of the R&D out west in more moderate to warmer climates.
We recommend the Power Vision and TTS because these allow us to modify the ECM w/out having to add any additional components to the bike. We like to dyno tune them because we know in a matter of several hours, most often, your bike is tuned properly for it and not based on someone else's bike. Although we have had customers come from as far as Indiana for tuning most of the bikes we tune will be ridden most often in a similar climate to our region. It is not uncommon to find, or hear, of bikes not running properly because of piggyback fuel management systems causing issues.
Because we are a performance shop we most often are tuning bikes that have engine performance modifications. If you are spending the money for performance you would not want to leave anything on the table because of a few hundred dollars. And though right now you may not want to do anymore than just an A/C upgrade and exhaust that does not mean that down the road you may not change your mind and want some motor work. Why not spend a little more now and get a better performing bike and be better set for any possible mods down the road?
We like to dyno tune but it can be tuned by you. Having a professional perform a dyno tune you can have the confidence that it will be correct. And you will have it that way in a short period of time versus trial and error and bike rides on your own.
If you are looking to save $ then options as the Fuelpak would certainly have to be considered. Fuel management systems as these are less expensive. They piggyback the ECM/ECU and these companies have made great effort to come up with maps for all kinds of scenarios regarding mods. They will likely be able to get your bike tuned close enough that most riders would not know that their bike could perform better. The most popular of these brands do most of the R&D out west in more moderate to warmer climates.
We recommend the Power Vision and TTS because these allow us to modify the ECM w/out having to add any additional components to the bike. We like to dyno tune them because we know in a matter of several hours, most often, your bike is tuned properly for it and not based on someone else's bike. Although we have had customers come from as far as Indiana for tuning most of the bikes we tune will be ridden most often in a similar climate to our region. It is not uncommon to find, or hear, of bikes not running properly because of piggyback fuel management systems causing issues.
Because we are a performance shop we most often are tuning bikes that have engine performance modifications. If you are spending the money for performance you would not want to leave anything on the table because of a few hundred dollars. And though right now you may not want to do anymore than just an A/C upgrade and exhaust that does not mean that down the road you may not change your mind and want some motor work. Why not spend a little more now and get a better performing bike and be better set for any possible mods down the road?
We like to dyno tune but it can be tuned by you. Having a professional perform a dyno tune you can have the confidence that it will be correct. And you will have it that way in a short period of time versus trial and error and bike rides on your own.
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Elite HDF Member
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From: Phoenix, AZ
DrewBone No, I have not yet bought one but Vance & Hines states that they have already dyno tested the sportster with the same AC intake and slip-on's that now have on the bike and they have a map for it matching the motor, intake and pipes- so the Fuelpak is an easy hookup for fuel management, I was just wondering if the Fuelpak would be a good choice or is it lacking something that might be critical to a proper tune-
Outstanding HDF Member
Joined: Dec 2010
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From: Temecula, CA
I'd say it's not lacking something critical but Skip's Speed and Custom broke it down about right.
Even though V&H have dyno tuned a bike with the exact same parts and engine on it that you have that doesn't mean it's going to work well for you. Now, good news is that living in Lakewood the climate that tune was done it probably is going to be pretty close to where you're at.
Even so, every engine is a little different...and I don't mean every type of engine but even different engines of the same type. So just because they dynoed it on an engine just like yours it's not the same as dynoing the parts on your bike.
Like I said though, Skip's gave it to you straight. There is a reason why I have a PowerVision with the AutoTune Pro on my Stage 1 bike.
Even though V&H have dyno tuned a bike with the exact same parts and engine on it that you have that doesn't mean it's going to work well for you. Now, good news is that living in Lakewood the climate that tune was done it probably is going to be pretty close to where you're at.
Even so, every engine is a little different...and I don't mean every type of engine but even different engines of the same type. So just because they dynoed it on an engine just like yours it's not the same as dynoing the parts on your bike.
Like I said though, Skip's gave it to you straight. There is a reason why I have a PowerVision with the AutoTune Pro on my Stage 1 bike.
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Elite HDF Member
Joined: Nov 2012
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From: Phoenix, AZ
I have a sportster 48 2011 with shortshots and power vision. They work fine and fit well. I don't have the auto tune,but never needed it. If you buy from fuel moto, Jamie will hook you up with the best map. Also free maps for future mods!
Outstanding HDF Member
Joined: Dec 2010
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From: Temecula, CA
The above was posted on another thread talking about the Power Vision Tuner. So Robo I understand there is nothing close to putting your own bike on a dyno when setting the tune but wouldn't even the Power Vision tuner fall into the same category as the Fuelpak in the sense of maybe not being right for your bike if (as the comment states) Jamie sends you a map because wouldn't that Map be derived from testing another bike?
Using the canned tune from Fuel Moto isn't going to be optimum for YOUR bike. However, since Fuel Motor can set up the tune for the specific modifications you've done it's going to be closer than a FuelPak. In addition, you can use the PowerVision's Autotune basic feature to tweak that tune specific to your mods on your bike in the area you ride in the most.
Now you won't get as good of a tune as you would with a dyno or the AutoTune Pro module for the PowerVision since you will be using the stock Narrow Band sensors. Still, this will be a better tune than a canned tune and Fuel Moto's canned tune will give you a good base tune to start with.
Understand that because the PV re-writes the ECM and can log data to see how the tune is performing. These two features alone put the PV in a totally difference class than the FuelPak which is a piggy back system that "spoofs" the ECM to do what it wants it to do and it is completely unadjustable. Even a PowerCommander III is a step up from a FuelPak since the PCIII can be adjusted.
Last edited by Robotech; Feb 10, 2013 at 01:24 AM.
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