DYNOJET: Help Me understand EFI Tuning...
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Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 21,116
Likes: 7,640
From: Poolville
Help Me understand EFI Tuning...
Iv'e always been a carbed guy and recently purchased my first Injected Twinkie..
I've been trying to wrap my head around EFI tuning and this is the way I currently understand it...
I have a 2013 FXDB with a 103"er that will be getting cams and heads and a _030 head gasket.. I already have Air and exhaust upgraded.
I'm leaning toward a Power Vision to flash a tune and then basic tune the motor.. Now the way I understand this is that with narrow band sensors at best this will tune in closed loop to possibly 14.1 AFR and that closed loop is controlled by the ECU but only up to 2500 rpm and then switches to open loop.. Then the flashed tune VE tables come in and through calculations of the ECU will adjust the fuel trim based on preset values in the VE tables... Is this corretc?.. Also these VE tables in open loop, are they called the target tune?
Hypothetically Lets say the flashed tune VE tables are set in a range from 14.1-13.2 outside the 2500 rpm range that the closed loop is controlling.. depending on RPM, MAP and throttle position the ECU will calculate what is necessary to achieve those values or target tune?.. Is this correct? So now the flashed tune with VE's in open loop preset will be target AFR's that the ECU will control?
Like I said, I'm trying to figure it out and I have not been able to get my head around it.. Thanx.. All help is appreciated...
I've been trying to wrap my head around EFI tuning and this is the way I currently understand it...
I have a 2013 FXDB with a 103"er that will be getting cams and heads and a _030 head gasket.. I already have Air and exhaust upgraded.
I'm leaning toward a Power Vision to flash a tune and then basic tune the motor.. Now the way I understand this is that with narrow band sensors at best this will tune in closed loop to possibly 14.1 AFR and that closed loop is controlled by the ECU but only up to 2500 rpm and then switches to open loop.. Then the flashed tune VE tables come in and through calculations of the ECU will adjust the fuel trim based on preset values in the VE tables... Is this corretc?.. Also these VE tables in open loop, are they called the target tune?
Hypothetically Lets say the flashed tune VE tables are set in a range from 14.1-13.2 outside the 2500 rpm range that the closed loop is controlling.. depending on RPM, MAP and throttle position the ECU will calculate what is necessary to achieve those values or target tune?.. Is this correct? So now the flashed tune with VE's in open loop preset will be target AFR's that the ECU will control?
Like I said, I'm trying to figure it out and I have not been able to get my head around it.. Thanx.. All help is appreciated...
6th Gear
Joined: Dec 2020
Posts: 10
Likes: 6
From: Austria
The narrowband sensors only work in a narrow range from approx. 14.2 to 15.
Check whether your AFR table is set accordingly - then carry out your VTune trips.
Have your VE tables corrected, then you can set the AFR table back to closed / openloop (where necessary).
Check whether your AFR table is set accordingly - then carry out your VTune trips.
Have your VE tables corrected, then you can set the AFR table back to closed / openloop (where necessary).
Road Warrior
Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 1,649
Likes: 443
From: Indianapolis
The narrow band sensors are most accurate in a range of of about 14.2 to 14.8 but they continue to provide a voltage even at 12.0 to ~17 to 1.
The ECU will only use the O2 voltages to adjust the injector pulse width when Lambda/Air Fuel Ratio are is a closed loop range (set normally in a tune table)
The early HD EFI only allowed "closed loop" when the AFR was at 14.6 to 1, later Lambda based tunes allowed closed loop in a range of AFRs.
The PowerVision includes a "built in" Auto Tune that uses the narrow band O2 sensors to adjust the Front / Rear VE values across the entire RPM/Throttle Position range.
Both the HD Tuner and PowerVision also offer a wide band O2 sensor option that will allow the ECU to adjust across the entire range of Lambda/Air Fuel Ratios as you ride.
The PowerVision "Target Tune" uses the wide band O2 sensors.
Before I bought a tuner, I found the HD Screamin Eagle Tuner training very helpful to begin to understand the HD EFI and what was involved in tuning.
It is available online here: Harley Davidson Street Tuner WBT Course
The DynoJet PowerVision gives you access to more Tune Tables to adjust and allows a wider range range of adjustment.
The ECU will only use the O2 voltages to adjust the injector pulse width when Lambda/Air Fuel Ratio are is a closed loop range (set normally in a tune table)
The early HD EFI only allowed "closed loop" when the AFR was at 14.6 to 1, later Lambda based tunes allowed closed loop in a range of AFRs.
The PowerVision includes a "built in" Auto Tune that uses the narrow band O2 sensors to adjust the Front / Rear VE values across the entire RPM/Throttle Position range.
Both the HD Tuner and PowerVision also offer a wide band O2 sensor option that will allow the ECU to adjust across the entire range of Lambda/Air Fuel Ratios as you ride.
The PowerVision "Target Tune" uses the wide band O2 sensors.
Before I bought a tuner, I found the HD Screamin Eagle Tuner training very helpful to begin to understand the HD EFI and what was involved in tuning.
It is available online here: Harley Davidson Street Tuner WBT Course
The DynoJet PowerVision gives you access to more Tune Tables to adjust and allows a wider range range of adjustment.
The narrow band sensors are most accurate in a range of of about 14.2 to 14.8 but they continue to provide a voltage even at 12.0 to ~17 to 1.
The ECU will only use the O2 voltages to adjust the injector pulse width when Lambda/Air Fuel Ratio are is a closed loop range (set normally in a tune table)
The early HD EFI only allowed "closed loop" when the AFR was at 14.6 to 1, later Lambda based tunes allowed closed loop in a range of AFRs.
The PowerVision includes a "built in" Auto Tune that uses the narrow band O2 sensors to adjust the Front / Rear VE values across the entire RPM/Throttle Position range.
Both the HD Tuner and PowerVision also offer a wide band O2 sensor option that will allow the ECU to adjust across the entire range of Lambda/Air Fuel Ratios as you ride.
The PowerVision "Target Tune" uses the wide band O2 sensors.
Before I bought a tuner, I found the HD Screamin Eagle Tuner training very helpful to begin to understand the HD EFI and what was involved in tuning.
It is available online here: Harley Davidson Street Tuner WBT Course
The DynoJet PowerVision gives you access to more Tune Tables to adjust and allows a wider range range of adjustment.
The ECU will only use the O2 voltages to adjust the injector pulse width when Lambda/Air Fuel Ratio are is a closed loop range (set normally in a tune table)
The early HD EFI only allowed "closed loop" when the AFR was at 14.6 to 1, later Lambda based tunes allowed closed loop in a range of AFRs.
The PowerVision includes a "built in" Auto Tune that uses the narrow band O2 sensors to adjust the Front / Rear VE values across the entire RPM/Throttle Position range.
Both the HD Tuner and PowerVision also offer a wide band O2 sensor option that will allow the ECU to adjust across the entire range of Lambda/Air Fuel Ratios as you ride.
The PowerVision "Target Tune" uses the wide band O2 sensors.
Before I bought a tuner, I found the HD Screamin Eagle Tuner training very helpful to begin to understand the HD EFI and what was involved in tuning.
It is available online here: Harley Davidson Street Tuner WBT Course
The DynoJet PowerVision gives you access to more Tune Tables to adjust and allows a wider range range of adjustment.
Road Warrior
Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 1,649
Likes: 443
From: Indianapolis
It looks like it did move to here: (it may be cloud based now seeing the "azurewebsites" in the link)
Harley Davidson Street Tuner WBT Course (hdst-hdstreettunerfunctionapp-prod.azurewebsites.net)
The actual software download page also has a link to the training:
Harley-Davidson Pro Street Tuner software download site
It looks like it still allows all 1's for the VIC serial number,1111111111, to download the software/tunes without having the actual VCI hardware.
You can also download the DynoJet WinPV software and get tunes from their web site-
Power Vision for Harley-Davidson | Downloads | Dynojet
The WinPV user guide has a good overview of the DynoJet software. (you don't have to have the PowerVision to look at tunes in the software)
98100016.08 User Guide For the Power Vision and WinPV Software (dynojet.com)
Harley Davidson Street Tuner WBT Course (hdst-hdstreettunerfunctionapp-prod.azurewebsites.net)
The actual software download page also has a link to the training:
Harley-Davidson Pro Street Tuner software download site
It looks like it still allows all 1's for the VIC serial number,1111111111, to download the software/tunes without having the actual VCI hardware.
You can also download the DynoJet WinPV software and get tunes from their web site-
Power Vision for Harley-Davidson | Downloads | Dynojet
The WinPV user guide has a good overview of the DynoJet software. (you don't have to have the PowerVision to look at tunes in the software)
98100016.08 User Guide For the Power Vision and WinPV Software (dynojet.com)
Last edited by shanneba; Mar 11, 2021 at 04:52 AM.
1st Gear
Joined: Jun 2021
Posts: 5
Likes: 1
From: Missouri
Not sure if this is the best place, but here goes. I've got a 2005 Road King with a powervision. Obviously, can't do autotune without the O2 sensors. I installed Freedom Performance 2 into 1's with SE air cleaner. It runs OK, using the SE/Vance and Hines 2 into 1, as there is no tune for the Freedom pipe. I have a lot of decel pop and it doesn't run very good when it's cold or the ambient temp is below 75. If it's 90 degrees, it runs pretty good. I'm assuming it's running lean. I would like to try to fix it with quicktune but not sure what to change. Anybody have suggestions? Would +5 global be a safe starting point? Dynojet was of no help. Their website says to add +5 AFR and +3 spark in the decel section to cure decel popping but that won't help the overall.
Thanks
Thanks
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